Vet P.O.V. A relationship with a pet shop is like a pact with the devil…for vets, that is

July 10th, 2007  

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WHOAH! Amen to all of the above!

As a vet, having a deal with a pet shop is just asking for trouble because eventually, the paper trail will lead back to you. Its almost like what they say about drunk drivers. The average drunk driver drives drunk 168 times before he is caught. The same can be said for vets who take kickbacks from pet shops. You may not get caught today, and you may not get caught tomorrow, but eventually, someone is going to catch you.

Making matters worse, if a customer get a sick puppy that you signed off on, not only will the customer come back to you, but the shop will too. They will claim ignorance of the fact and probably come out with nothing more than a refund for the pet.

The entire concept of pet shops and vets in collusion really gets on my nerves. My job at work is to frown upon "too much friendliness". Thats not to say that social networking doesn't exist or isn't encouraged, but when an employee becomes far too friendly with another employee (especially external employees and contractors), there is often trouble brewing! Because I see the dishonesty that stems from unhealthy working relationships, I try to be extra cautous when entering an agreement with another entity. If something seems to easy or seems too good to be true, it probably is!

Wendy July 10th, 2007 10:28:00 AM

I have a great respect for you an your opinions. Some of your posts have made it into my Yahoo dog group files (with your permission).

This is at least the second post of yours I've read dealing with the shortcomings of the vet professional association(s). The last one, as I recall, dealt with the embarrasment of coming into work on Monday to sick and dying animals and not knowing it was kidney failure due to commercial pet foods. Your association either didn't know either or didn't feel it incumbent upon them to warn their members. You have written several enlightening posts about the economics of the vet profession. You may have written, although I cannot recall, about the dubious connection between the vets and the companies for whom they sell foods.

My first reaction to this latest is how can you call this a professional association? Do they do anything except give you a certificate to put on your wall to reassure your clients. (Which, in your case, is fine, but the others....) Being an aging adult, however, I realise that things may not be quite that simple. But I do wonder if you, together with other vets with your sensibilities and standards, can't try to effect some kind of change.

Unethical vets and their troubles with the law are the least of it as far as we, the public, are concerned. The tragic results of these practices are encountered every day by the thousands of people working with the fall-out: the abandoned sick dogs dumped in refuges; the over-aged 5-year-old breeding machines who have earned everything they can for the puppy farms and are sold at auction because they're of no economic value now; the huge vet and behaviourist bills taken on by responsible owners who, having adopted a dog from a rescue, won't abandon it again; and the worst: THE PERPETUATION OF THE AGONY OF TENS OF THOUSANDS OF ANIMALS BECAUSE THE VERY PEOPLE IN A POSITION TO END THEIR SUFFERING THROUGH PUBLIC EDUCATION KEEP THEIR MOUTHS SHUT.

I don't know how much time you've spent in puppy mills or treating their products. Here's an education site: www.maryshouse.us. I know that there are many hard-working, dedicated vetinarians with real feelings for their patients. But the profession as a whole chooses to ignore by inaction those animals that aren't coming through their waiting rooms.

Margot July 10th, 2007 11:42:00 AM

Margot: You have my agreement on your basic sentiments. In fact, I know few vets who would disagree with you on most of your points. Speaking power to authority on this issue is not an easy thing to do, though--especially when it "infringes on the livelihood of others," illegal though this livelihood is likely to be. I mentioned the difficulty of proving malfeasance--and this is one of the reasons the State Board doesn't go after these offenders as a group. But professional regulatory bodies are also constrained by their system: they receive complaints and then initiate investigations. They don't tend to police their licensees in any other way. Consumers of vet services are free, however, to lodge complaints against any veterinarian they believe is acting outside the ethical or legal bounds of the profession. These complaints are always investigated. Veterinarians, in fact, have a legal and ethical duty to report vets they *know* are running afoul of regulations. But a reputed association with a pet shop is not sufficient evidence for us to submit a complaint. Receiving a negligently incomplete health certificate is. And that's when we're required to act. I don't know how many vets do. I'm willing to bet that few of us would go out on a limb to damage someone we know is doing something wrong. And that's where the system breaks down. We need to do better. You are so right on that score.

Dr. Patty Khuly July 10th, 2007 12:16:00 PM

Well, I did say I'm old enough to realise the problem isn't simple. :-) Could the vets who don't have ties to the pet shop / puppy mills industry not do more for education, I wonder. Posters in their waiting rooms and such?

By the way, I'd like to put a link to your blog on my blog, if that's O.K.

Margot July 10th, 2007 02:39:00 PM

Yeah, getting any types of animals from big-box pet stores is generally not a good idea. I'm at a loss sometimes to understand the poor condition of the fish in the aquarium displays at PetCo. I mean, they've got bottles of formalin on the shelves, yet every fish in there is covered with external parasites. I've been down in South Dade for a little over two years now, and I'm constantly amazed by the number of "Puppy Store" type places around here. It seems like there is literally one in every strip mall from Kendal on south. It's too bad for the dogs, but there's obviously a strong market for cheap and readily available puppies down here. My dog came from one of these types of stores. I got her through a rescue group when her original owners grew tired of dealing with her. Their loss, she's the best dog I've ever had.

In other news, I don't think we need to worry too much about getting any more tainted food products (pet or otherwise) from China. Well, you can't say the Chinese aren't serious about cleaning up their food industry anymore. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/artic...

Chip July 10th, 2007 02:52:00 PM

Chip: Yeah. I saw they *executed* the guy. Impressive--and bizarre by our American standards.

Margot: Sure you may. I love linkage!

Dr. Patty Khuly July 10th, 2007 03:59:00 PM

When I lived in Ft. Lauderdale a few years ago, I took my dogs to a local vet. I was always amazed by the number of teeny puppies in the waiting room. Most were newly purchased, and from chatting with the owners - most were suffering from kennel cough or worse. The owners said the pet store who had sold the puppies recommended they bring their dogs to this vet.

The vet and I soon parted ways, as I disagreed with the multiple tests, high fees and the insistance that my dogs & cats have every available vaccination every year - even after 2 dogs and one cat had allergic reactions. Needless to say, I was an unhappy client.

What a surprise later when I discovered this same vet was issuing the health certificates for obviously unhealthy dogs for a notorious puppy-mill pet shop/on-line retailer. The same pet store mentioned earlier in this blog that is being sued by the HSUS. As I followed the case, I learned the vet also owns the strip mall where the pet store is located. I assume this vet is still in practice, but I feel sorry for the poor animals seen in the office!

Susan July 10th, 2007 05:24:00 PM

Wow, I love this! I am whistling, stomping and clapping. Impressive, considering I'm also typing as fast as I can too.
:D

More vets need to admit that in this case the Emporor has no clothing. It isn't ok to make deals with those pet stores which treat puppies so horribly.

Our local puppy-mill fed pet store prominently displays the name of the local vet who supposedly provides care for their puppies. After leaving in tears the last time I set foot in that store, I decided to call the vet. I told the receptionist that I had a few questions for him about caring for a new puppy, and she was ever so eager to put my call through. When he got on the phone, I asked if he thought I should make my puppy pee in its food dish. He said that I certainly shoulod not. I asked if he would advise me to make my new puppy sleep in its own urine and excrement. By this time he was angry, and said that of course not. I then asked if it was ok for new puppies to be kept in boxes of urine and feces, and he shouted at me that I was a terribly irresponsible pet owner if I did any of those things.

When I pointed out that all of the puppies he was "caring" for lived in exactly those conditions and that his signature was his recommendation, he hung up on me. I wish I could say that I made him think, but the store still operates the same way and he is still the vet, so nothing new there. It's so wonderful to find a vet who will stick up for all animals. Please keep doing this, and do it loudly.

Cindy July 10th, 2007 07:18:00 PM

I once rescued a puppy from a pet sore that had seizures. They couldn't sell him so they finally gave him up to me when he got really sick. They originally told me they would just discount his price and sell him anyway. I had seen him in the window of the pet store seizuring and went in to insist they take him out of the window. (The 20ish manager barely looked old enough to drive.) Normally I refuse to set foot in them.

Once I got him and the medications he was on we went to my vet where it was immediately noticed that they put him on the wrong dose of phenobarb with NO bloodwork by the pet stores vet. I wish I had the presence of mind at the time to report that jerk.

The puppy (an akita) got adopted to a great home through rescue. He had a liver shunt and eventually outgrew the seizures.

Marie July 10th, 2007 08:38:00 PM

This is on a related matter (if you stretch a point),ie where they may be NO veterinary care and a facility.(I agree with your points about vets and pet stores btw).
I am involved with a national breed rescue and live in Virginia. We have had many occasions to try to help dogs from the Miami-Dade shelter. The shelter tries their best to get rescues to take whatever dogs they can (and we do if we can get there in time),but some rescues will not go there at all,citing the (alleged ) need to isolate dogs they pull from there for up to two weeks. There is a high incidence of kennel cough and I am told many dogs don't survive at the shelter once they become sick.
Many of my local volunteers and even some area vets are reluctant to handle dogs from this facility,even if the animals are asymptomatic.
You may not want to address this on your blog,but I would like to know more about this shelter from your POV as a vet and as someone familiar with the area.
I am new to your blog and looking forward to future entries.

Marsha July 10th, 2007 10:42:00 PM

You are linked. http://nightmaredogowner.blogspot.com/

Margot July 11th, 2007 04:18:00 AM

Could you tell me the spanish version of the saying in the beginning of this entry? I know that it always makes more sense in spanish. Such great common sense.
Brenda

Brenda July 11th, 2007 09:32:00 AM

I worked in a pet store as a teenager (25 years ago!). I tried to take everything home with me... But I remember very well that we had a vet tech that would come to the store and do wormings, puppy shots, etc. Parvo was rampant in the store. I don't remember ever seeing an actual vet; just the tech. I took home a female Doberman that had been in the store in a cage for so long that her front legs were bowing. They told me something about the growth plates in her legs, that it was genetic, blah blah blah. She couldn't stand up straight in her cage. Broke my heart. I took her home, gave her lots of love and good food and exercise, she straightened right out. That was my first foray into fostering... It was hard to let her go, but it did my heart wonders to see that she had a great home and was healthy.

Kim July 11th, 2007 05:35:00 PM

Brenda: The Spanish version is actually quite literal so it offers few insights, but here goes: "No escupas para arriba que tal vez te cae en la cara."

Dr. Patty Khuly July 13th, 2007 08:56:00 AM

I've actually been on both sides of the fence on the vet clinic/pet shop relationship issue. When I worked for a national practice in Bradenton, I had several newly-purchased puppies presented to me from a chain pet store for first exams. We had no professional relationship with the pet store in question at all, so I was free to call things as I saw them. Two of the puppies I saw in one week had loose stools, and we found <i>Giardia</i> trophozoites in the stool; both puppies were loaded, as I recall!

The plot thickened when, while taking a history, I found out the (human) infant in the family developed diarrhea shortly after obtaining the puppy. I referred them to their pediatrician, who diagnosed <i>Giardiasis</i>. Long story short, the County Health Department got involved, and actually shut down puppy sales at this pet store for one month, so that the facilities could be thoroughly cleaned.

Imagine my distress, then, when I joined a private practice after my time with the national one, and had to do postpurchase exams on usually sick puppies that had been signed off as healthy by my practice owner. I didn't do well with walking that particular tightrope, and ended up leaving that practice.

I now do relief work in Illinois!

Andy
Alton IL

AAbshier July 17th, 2007 05:46:00 PM

For Maria who posted a comment on 9/11/07 - Maria asked -
Has anyone bothered to look up this amazing little company Righteous Dog Food mentioned in the article?
# Posted By Maria | 9/11/07 1:53 PM

ANSWER: WOOF Patrol not only looked them up we interviewed them. Place the following link in your browser and read - The Paw-Righteous Movement is RIGHT ON!
http://www.woofpatrol.com/newsletters/wpe/2007_oct...
woofpatrol@mindspring.com

Yvonne Conza October 9th, 2007 11:44:00 AM

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