Have you ever started reading a book only to find that after rocking your world for sixty-plus pages it next serves up a section so annoying you're hard-pressed to actually finish it?
That’s what happened to me with Nathan Winograd’s revered book, Redemption: The Myth of Pet Overpopulation and the No-Kill Revolution in America.
Its basic tenet? Our system of shelter management is broken, but not irreparably so. There is a way back from the high death rates and blind-eyed euthanasias visited upon our nation’s so-called, “unwanted” pets. How? A sea change in ideology is all that’s required.
Admittedly, that’s easier said than done. That’s why Redemption offers a detailed history of the philosophies, politics and practices that led us astray while offering clearly articulated solutions to how we might rebound from the brink of despair. Overall, it does a masterful job of it.
Extolling the no-kill revolution in key shelters across the country, Winograd convincingly debates, in a manner borne of his lawyerly beginnings and shelter management experience, the virtues of reversing our mindset when it comes to the need for systematic euthanasia of “unwanted” pets. He shows us the way home, if only we’ll open our minds enough to follow his yellow brick road.
Because of his revolutionary zeal and [generally] scholarly approach, Winograd’s book has made the rounds among all of us pet blogger types in recent months. It’s earned accolades and has even been credited with changing lives—not least those of animals granted reprieves based on the shelter practices he champions in this book.
I’ll admit, I was predisposed towards Redemption. After all, Gina Spadafori at Pet Connection was actually driven to deny she and Mr. Winograd were engaged in a love affair after she praised it to the heavens so frequently. And I trust Gina’s instincts near-implicitly.
That’s why I ordered it online back in October(?), awaited my Amazon box anxiously and sat down to read it with a highlighter pen in one hand and a pencil in the other. Such were my high hopes for this text.
And I wasn’t disappointed. But it took me a long time to finish Redemption. Halfway through, I came to a chapter that challenged my understanding of facts so utterly I was unable to reconcile its failure with the success of the rest of the book. In keeping with my goal of a fully open mind, however, I powered through and finally finished last week, only to let it percolate in my brain before I was willing to write anything concrete about my impressions.
To be sure this was a gratifyingly eye-opening read. That’s quite a statement for someone raised in the animal services industry and deeply inculcated in the beliefs Winograd effectively disabuses me of.
Nonetheless, I’ve been unable to rise above my reservations on the issue of feral cats he presents in the aforementioned chapter.
That’s because relatively early on in his book, Winograd tries to establish a bedrock argument on the myth of the feral cat as an evil that must be eradicated. In so doing, he attempts to persuade his readers that feral cats are not a danger to the environment—nor inherently less healthy than indoor cats.
While I understand his rationale for recruiting this argument in a chapter titled, “Witch Hunt,” I bristled at the blanket condemnation of my own views on the environment and the increased safety of indoor cats—even more so when he proposed that people like me were behind the very behaviors and practices I abhor.
To make his argument, he first references one non-representative study (undertaken in rural North Florida) to report that outdoor cats live 92% as long as indoor cats, thereby justifying their outdoor existence on the basis of salubrious survival alone. Whatever else he might argue afterwards, as a veterinarian I cannot condone the practice of clean outdoor living for cats—especially given my lengthy experience comparing both sets of cat populations in two different suburban locales in the United States.
Moreover, it’s my view that outdoor catdom should be anathema to the beliefs of anyone engaged so fully in the struggle for control of animal populations. Justifying the right to life of outdoor ferals is one thing; effectively supporting a less healthy environment for an owned cat is quite another.
I also object to his setting as “incontrovertible” fact the contention that cats are not having an impact on our environment. Relying on two of the least revealing and most methodology-challenged studies on the issue as foundation for his argument, Winograd conveniently ignores contemporary and subsequent studies supporting the negative impact of cats on the environment (all of which were available to him at the time of publication).
Furthermore, his argument against “nativism” (the idea that native species are more deserving of existence than non-natives) is offensive. The fact that we, whose careful interest in healthy ecosystems leads us to engage in trap-neuter-and-release (to less environmentally sensitive areas), should be lumped in with those who would kill cats (effectively for their simplistic view of environmental politics as he presents it) is insulting.
Treating my dual concern for cat and wildlife health as if it were part of a larger conspiracy against felines in general entirely misses the mark and forced me to call in to question much of what I’d read before I hit this chapter. It raised the concern that other studies he might be relying on to make larger points might also require vetting.
To my reading, Winograd should have steered clear of arguments pitting environmentalists against cat supporters, for we’re often one and the same. Still, I understand his desire to take another jab at HSUS in so doing, as HSUS was instrumental in once proposing eradication of feral cat colonies for reasons including songbird population decimation. HSUS has since softened its stance, but that fact arrives on Redemption’s pages as an afterthought to this chapter.
Clearly, Winograd wins us over most convincingly in the roles he plays best: that of shelter manager, historian and needless-euthanasia antagonist. His clear mastery of the history involved would have been better served by more assiduous referencing, but I can forgive this somewhat given the density of his report and his need to reach a wider audience. Still, I love footnotes.
Frustrated and angry as it made me, at times, I’ll never think the same way after having experienced this book. I hope most of you get a chance to read it and come through with your own unique take. Despite my concerns, this is perhaps the most life-altering read of my year (and I read a lot).
So kudos, Mr. Winograd. I hope we get a chance to meet soon so that I can tell you in person what reading your book has done for my personal beliefs on a wider range of topics than I can effectively address here.
Add Comment30 Comments
I just started reading Redemption, and I was a little concerned that was the direction he'd be going. I just took in a street cat that a lot of my neighbors had been feeding. I suppose I could have spayed her and sent her back out, but I just can't believe that she could have lived 92% as long out on the street as she will in my newly cat-friendly spare bedroom. I also can't bare the thought of her killing birds, so inside she'll stay.
Do you have any experience with feral cats being brought indoors? I adopted a dog last year that had no interaction with people for the first three years of its life. A co-worker had taken in a feral cat at the same time, and we followed each other's progress. I found a trainer, but my co-worker couldn't find anything. I tried to find some resources for her, but everything on feral cats is geared towards TNR.
Jen (SLC) December 31st, 2007 12:16:00 PM
kudos's, Dr Patty. I have the SAME problem with that chapter. You didn't even mention the biologically bizarre "cats are identically the same as wild animals and therefore should live outside" part of his argument. And NONE of the TNR advocates every have an answer for the "why do I have to allow cats the right to trespass on, and destroy, my property?" question.
But there's a more fundamental flaw I have discussed on other blogs: the insistence on using the term "no kill" when he does NOT mean "no" "kill" (he means 90-95% save). Besides simply being wrong, the term has so much negative baggage associated with it (such as hoarding, selective intakes, abuse of temperament tests, all of which he has to take pains to assert are not part of a real "no kill" vision) that it automatically repels people who actually support the vision he is trying to promote. The entirely proper goal to kill only those animals that are incurably sick or irredemably vicious is set back by pretending that some kinds of killing ("good killing" = "euthanisia") aren't really killing.
The movement needs another name.
EmilyS December 31st, 2007 12:41:00 PM
I too approached Redemption with a lot of enthusiasm after reading about it here and there, and based upon the enthusiasm of people whose opinions I generally respect. I spent a lot of time trying very hard to not chuck the book across the room, it offended me so greatly in sections. The feral cat bit was a huge one, but, truth be told, I got so sick and tired of the endless finger-pointing. I guess every good book needs a villain, and I don't like the HSUS or Peta any more than anybody else, but geez.
I agree with this guy on a lot of stuff, and I know he's trying to be Mr. Revolutionary, but ugh.
katie December 31st, 2007 01:07:00 PM
Jen,
Tell your friend to read up everything she can about cat behavior. It will help her understand the cat better and it's communication as well as behavior issues. (Assuming it has some. Most true ferals I know are quite shy with people having lacked socialization with humans as kittens.) In my experience most problems people have with their pets stems from a lack of knowledge about their normal behavior and miscommunication between them.
I'm reading a pretty good cat behavior book right now called "Is your cat crazy" by John Wright PhD. I also have "The cats mind" by Dr. Bruce Fogel waiting to be read next. (both from ebay)
There are also some good websites and blogs out there too. Perhaps there is a list for feral adopters she can use as a resource?
www.TheCatSite.com is pretty good. Herding cats has alot of great cat behavior info.
Good luck!
Marie December 31st, 2007 05:16:00 PM
I think this book will be an interesting read for us Australians, as feral cats are an issue here. Our native animal populations evolved in the absence of this type of predator and have minimal ways of protecting themselves from cats.
parlance December 31st, 2007 09:29:00 PM
P.S. Did anyone else see the article about the L.A. police departments using adopting and using (previously unadoptable) feral cats to solve a huge rodent problem?
Marie January 1st, 2008 09:12:00 AM
Patty, I agree that Nathan's approach on these topics is pretty extreme but I think we'd all agree, it's got us talking a whole lot about it. I too was felt Redemption changed me unlike any book I've read.
Any change you could redo the feral cat discussion yourself if you can ever spare a moment?. I would love to see the presentation of all the studies you talk about so I could work through what it all means.
Laura Bennett January 1st, 2008 11:20:00 AM
You do realize that the only reason that the breeder lobby promotes Nathan Winograd is because he supports their concept of No Rules, No Laws, No Regulations for breeders?
And because he blindly attacks the humane organizations that they hate?
There is a reason that this person http://www.consumerdeception.com was promoting Nathan's book and issuing news releases for him.
Nathan Winograd stopped making sense a long time ago, but breeders will support him because he supports some of their basic lobbying interests.
Tina January 1st, 2008 12:43:00 PM
I have to confess that I've been kind of put off of this book just by it's reputation. The people who I know who have recommended it are people who I feel I don't really agree with on a lot of issues--people who take pot shots at HSUS any chance they get, even when it's not really germane to the conversation, and people who knee-jerk freak out against any animal welfare or husbandry regulations (to the point where the term "tinfoil hat" comes to mind). I'm also already pretty jaded on the whole "no kill" thing and the commenter who said that Winograd's use of that term could turn some people off, well, consider me turned off.
cressida January 1st, 2008 01:13:00 PM
(1) You make the same gloss over unreferenced studies that Winograd does, except unlike the book, your blog has no bibliography where we might find the information even without footnotes. You can't win an argument about poor documentation with poor documentation yourself!
(2) You and the other comments seem to be stuck on one issue a piece, basically being lumped in with people who Winograd bashes. That's a fault of an absolutist mentality, and despite such rhetoric also being used by Winograd, it's the consumer who needs to be more flexible and rational on such issues. All producers, whether they be Coca Cola trying to sell you sugar water or the HSUS trying to solicit your donations speak with a high degree of absolutism, since beating home a singular message is an effective sales technique.
Why do you think that almost all religious services have a mantra they repeat again and again? It works.
But consumers can pick and choose what they buy and why they buy it. So too can you pick and choose what elements of Winograd's arguments resonate with you.
The reason Winograd's book is so resonant in general, despite the fact that what he is saying is not particularly new or particularly unique is that he is effective at combining the problem and the solution into a package that can be "sold." So it is with "No Kill" ... that name resonates more with the public than any other name you might suggest for the movement. Same with "shelter" which is so off the mark as to be a sin. But calling kill factories "shelters" has done well to cloak the abomination that was and is our "shelter" system.
You need to be able to take criticism when it applies to you and disregard it when it does not, even if it still applies to lots of people who might be lumped into a word that describes you.
If you're a person who volunteers for your local SPCA's foster care program, aren't you smart enough to realize that Winograd's condemnation of shelter programs that don't use volunteers and don't have foster care programs DOES NOT APPLY TO YOU?!?!
And if Winograd bashes an aspect of your shelter's methods that should be questioned, that all the other good your shelter does has no relation to their failure in that area and that the criticism is valid and should be addressed? You wouldn't ignore your child's F in Algebra just because they had an A+ in Biology, would you?
Such complaints (and several are made in the comments above) come from a mentality that thinks that an organization must be either all good or all bad... or if it's mostly good you shouldn't complain about the bad lest you hurt the good that the organization is doing.
Such logic is the reason obsolete methodologies are allowed to persist for as long as they do. Whistle blowers become cast as enemies of the organization because the entrenched leadership sees any criticism as poison and thus doesn't allow any. So instead of evolving and allowing for problems to be addressed as new solutions are found, it comes to civil wars and corporate takeovers and whistle blowers who inevitably bring the whole house down because it's too late to repair and renovate.
(3) On Feral Cats in particular, I'll note that Winograd does not suggest that inside cats are inferior and that all cats should be made to be outdoor cats or even feral cats. You and others seem offended because your rationale for indoor cats seems at least in part based upon "I'm doing what's best for the cat." Perhaps the studies he references knock your indoor cat righteousness down a peg, but what's wrong with that?
I suspect that you and others rationalized the question of whether you wanted indoor cats or outdoor cats and THEN found the studies to back you up. I doubt it was the other way around, reading all the research and then coming to a decision. Really, who does that?
Winograd's point seems simple to me. People who buy into the combined logic of "I'm saving my cats by keeping them inside, so if you have your cats outside, you're killing them" and "it is more humane to kill cats than to allow them to live imperfect lives outside, since there is no one to make them indoor cats which is the only acceptable arrangement" leading them to "kill those cats to save them" solution.
Winograd attacks both parts of that, and taking indoor cat ethic off its untouchable pedestal might piss you off, but it's a perfectly legitimate means to keeping the debate about reality and not about dogma.
Too many fads in the animal world become religion, like raw feeding. I seriously cringe when I read about individuals from rescue groups who don't adopt an animal to a home that doesn't raw feed or a breeder who won't sell to a home that doesn't raw feed. What? Feeding evangelism is creating a religious war, not a war of logic nor of reality.
If indoor catdom is your one and only true religion, fine, but lets not pretend that discussions of religion are discussions of science. The rules are not the same.
Border Wars - Christopher January 1st, 2008 03:08:00 PM
I have wanted to read this book for a long time, and your review is propelling me to order it online immediately.
While I agree with you about the superior health and safety of indoor cats, I have to say that I find your opinion about outdoor cats impact on the environment and wildlife (I assume you are concerned about birds . . . among other things) frustrating. Reminds me of a debate I had online earlier this year over the case of a man who shot a cat (unknown whether feral or domestic) that was headed toward some plovers.
It is really unfair for we, as humans, through our reckless development, use of pesticides, destruction of habitat, etc. to drive species (songbirds, etc) to the point of peril, and then demonize cats for picking some of the remaining animals off, because their populations have been made so fragile by OUR activities.
MAN is the biggest threat to wildlife, including the songbirds that the anti-cat ranters usually focus on.
All my cats are indoor cats -- for their health and safety. I keep hoping to have the bucks to fence in my back yard with "Cat Fence In" so that they can enjoy some of the outdoors and make their lives ever so much more interesting. Iin the meantime, they will have to live with access to a screened porch. If I do get my fence put up, they will have collars with bells and their outdoor excursions will be supervised, again with an eye toward their safety and also toward reducing the liklihood that they will kill something other than insects.
But in defense of outdoor cats, whether feral or domestic, I have to say that the concern over their impact on suburban "wild" life is hypocritical coming from the Earth's biggest plunderer.
Not you personally, you understand: me, everyone. All of us.
If somebody's activities need to be curtailed for the sake of wildlife, heaven knows its US first.
Stefani January 1st, 2008 03:25:00 PM
Many of the extremist feral cat people (the ones who state that feral cats have nothing to do with wildlife decimation) also oppose things like spay neuter laws, for their own reasons.
But that is reason enough for the breeder lobby to support that lobby.
And defend Nathan's extremist stance on feral cats.
Breeders will support anyone who opposes laws they don't want. Just the way the world works.
Pretty much the same sort of alliances as the political & business world. Every group has their own agenda, and they support the groups that support their interests, or hate what they perceive as their enemies.
Winograd's book is really most illustrative of the ambitions and desires and interests of various lobbying groups than anything else.
The animals themselves get lost in all the wrangling.
Tina January 1st, 2008 04:17:00 PM
Tina, did it ever occur to you that the "breeder lobby" is not one group of people marching in lock-step? You write, "You do realize that the only reason that the breeder lobby promotes Nathan Winograd is because he supports their concept of No Rules, No Laws, No Regulations for breeders?"
This, of course, is complete and utter nonsense. Ethical, responsible breeders (those of us who have dogs from them) care just as much about animals as you do. My own family is a mostly "second-hand" pets along with those I complete with in dog sports for their pleasure as much (if not more than) my own.
I've never bred a litter, and I've run a breed rescue fostering an placing up to 30 pets a year from my own home. I support, and continue to support, ethical, responsible breeding, because those breeders are not the problem. (Indeed, by definition, a responsible, ethical breeder is responsible for life for every animal born into her care. Any age, any problem, any question ... the animal can come back.)
I support Nathan Winograd and Richard Avanzino because what shelters are doing isn't working, and because I don't believe that working harder at something that isn't working is the answer, even if it will make you who hate all breeders (because all breeders are the same in your mind) feel morally superior.
I don't hate the HSUS. I have some issues with them, but I have admired many of the staff and programs over the years. But I do not believe more laws aren't going to turn the tide here. I will not support breeding bans that give passes to puppy mills (as California's proposal does), that put laws on the books for quick-buck breeders who don't mind the laws already there and that target responsible, ethical breeders who are preserving our heritage breeds.
The "only reason" I support what's in "Redemption" and what Maddie's Fund is trying to do is because these policies work and will save lives.
It's a mind-blowing read, but you have to open your mind to read it. And drop the hate, because it's not serving any animals at all.
Gina Spadafori January 1st, 2008 08:16:00 PM
"Many of the extremist feral cat people (the ones who state that feral cats have nothing to do with wildlife decimation) also oppose things like spay neuter laws, for their own reasons."
and what reasons would they be? I've known quite a few "feral cat people" and have never known them to do anything other than work tirelessly to stabilization the population by TNR.
This book isn't different than any other argument you can always find an article to footnote in support of whatever side you choose to follow. I especially liked Christopher's take on this:
"I suspect that you and others rationalized the question of whether you wanted indoor cats or outdoor cats and THEN found the studies to back you up. I doubt it was the other way around, reading all the research and then coming to a decision. Really, who does that?"
Yup, I'm guilty as charged, how about you?
Jules January 1st, 2008 08:43:00 PM
Gina, my sister is a breeder.
All your anti-law and anti-rule rhetoric is very familiar to me. For my sister and her fellow breeders, no law is a good law.
They'll spend hours coming up with reasons why any proposed law is somehow going to exterminate breeds or whatever. And some of those reasons are quite specious.
That's not a surprise. People lobby to protect their own interests, and it doesn't really matter if their objections make sense or not. They have their own agendas, and that's just the way it is.
You sound defensive about the fact that breeders support people that support their own agendas and interests. Why?
It is the way the world works. It's not bad or unusual.
And breeders support Nathan Winograd because he is opposed to rules or laws, and caters to their interests.
He also attacks the humane groups that they loathe. The ones that support rules and laws.
There's nothing wrong with supporting an ally. As I said before, that's the way that business and political and all lobbies work. Your allies are the ones that...agree with you and your lobby's interests.
But the problem is that Nathan's concepts are deeply flawed, he does manipulate studies to promote his ideas, and he's not honest about many things.
And you talk about hate. Nathan Winograd has some issues with that. He's a very hostile person that often attacks groups and people simply for the reason that he doesn't like them, or they disagree with him.
A lot of his efforts lately have seemed to devolve completely into attacks that really serve no purpose.
Too often his agenda is not based on what is good for animals. It is based on what is best for Nathan's agenda.
And he still is touting programs that have failed (like in Ithaca.) He just doesn't talk about the failures.
There's nothing "mind blowing" about any of that. It's pretty much the same thing- bickering and special interests in the pet world.
Tina January 2nd, 2008 10:13:00 AM
Also Gina, you are involved in the breeding world. I don't know why you wouldn't mention that?
Why would you think that anyone thinks breeders are bad? I'm confused here.
Tina January 2nd, 2008 10:22:00 AM
Did you miss it? I said I had both rescue pets and pets from breeders, and I support reputable, ethical breeders and compete with my dogs in sports. My life is an open book ... actually, several open books, including best-sellers.
Reputable, ethical breeders loathe puppy mills and quick-buck casual breeders just as much as you do.
There is a way we can all work together. But it won't be by wiping out good breeders and endangered heritage breeds. (And it's not hyberbole; some of these breeds have extremely small populations.)
All breeders are not the same. Those I support are not puppy-millers or profiteers, and they love animals every bit as much as you do. I know very few people in dog sports who don't also have a shelter dog or cat as part of their family, and who don't volunteer to help homeless pets in some way or another.
I support the Winograd/Maddie's Fund vision because not because I profit from breeding but because I don't believe that punishing people who aren't problem is the answer. And because I believe that community-wide solutions may be.
Gina Spadafori January 2nd, 2008 11:15:00 AM
Christopher:
Touché on the references. Would that I had more time to devote to submitting an alternative chapter that makes Winograd's point equally well--without denigrating the practices of those that would take a more holistic view of the environment.
Perhaps I'm reacting to the absolutist tone Winograd himself applies equally to all chapters--to the benefit of his larger argument, as you note in your point on hammering home the "religious mantra."
On being bashed by Winograd: True, we don't all have to agree 100% on every point. If that were the case, the richness of discussion would be lost and the post-read considerations ignored--that's not good for the book, either. I agree completely with you. Why else would I take the time to write a post on this subject at all?
On feral cats: To be sure, I'm a big follower of this issue and somewhat sensitive on it. Though he does not state up front that cats should not live indoors, he does state explicitly that cats are fine out of doors. I can handle being "knocked down a peg" in the service of a larger argument, but that doeesn't mean I don't deserve the right to be less than swayed by his points on ferals.
On adopting a stance and defending it blindly: You effectively rgue against *anyone* being able to integrate any new ideas. Why read the book at all, then, if not to learn, grow, be enlightened, and potentially alter your perspective? I believe my approach to feral cats has been altered at least three or four times this year alone. Ditto an almost any subject I approach in this blog.
I, for one, think it's impressive that so many are taking the time to read this book thoroughly enough to take a stand against the points he makes. Why present a text at all if we should be expected to swallow it whole?
I agree, however, with your view of the mind-closedly overly-absolutist, blanketly-negative reviews based on taking a few points out of the book's larger context. I don't think that was my take. The fact that I don't agree with him in one chapter (no matter how vehemently) does not mean that I'm withholding credit where it's due--quite the opposite, which makes my review all the more positive. If I were, I think I'd be more deserving of your tone.
Finally, thank you for the insight on religion vs. science as it applies to this book. Despite his religious overtones, you argue that ultimately this is science. I'd argue it's more about technology than science, but presented with such religious zeal that it's understandably interpreted as religion by a great many of his readers. I'm guilty of the same in my writing--as are you. And maybe that's what it takes to be considered at all by readers, but I think you'll agree it's a double-edged sword we weild.
Dr. Patty Khuly January 2nd, 2008 01:04:00 PM
Tina, you are way off base on Nathan Winograd, and on breeders, for that matter.
Nathan Winograd is popular BECAUSE HIS IDEAS WORK, AND WORK BETTER THAN ANYTHING ELSE. The shelter near my house, an open admission, animal control shelter, is one of Winograd's models. It is 92% live exit. Not 92% of "adoptables" - 92% of all admissions.
I have seen no other approach that works anywhere near as well. This shelter is the Real Deal.
Good breeders support Winograd for 2 reasons that I've seen - first, that his ideas really do work, very very well, and good breeders actually do care about unwanted animals. Second, unlike many people proposing laws, his suggestions do not advantage puppy mills and hurt good breeders.
You are correct that some very vocal breeder advocates are knee jerk against any law. That is wrong.
You are DEAD WRONG that all breeders just care about their personal interests. As a group, good breeders (serious breeders, reputable breeders, whatever you want to call them) help animals, love animals, and their practices help reduce animal overpopulation. Their practices make it impossible for most to break even, much less make a profit - and they glory in the fact that they don't break even. It's not a money thing for the good ones.
What we need is for people to look to rescue and adoption for pets, and if they choose to buy a pet, to buy it from a good breeder, not a puppy mill or casual breeder. That, and the prevention of unplanned and unwanted litters, are key to ending unwanted animals in this country.
Moving people from puppy mills, to good breeders who educate, screen, and place pups on s/n contracts does, however, require that you not stop the good breeders from breeding.
One of the saddest things about this whole whoo ha - the extremist "make a law for everything all breeders are bad" people and the extremist "no law is good and there is no such thing as a bad breeder" people - is that the animals lose. Crummy laws get proposed and passed, and good ones fail.
Some of the proposed laws actually favor puppy mills - whether you're looking at AB 1634, with its free pass for the millls, or a recently suggested law in Virginia, that makes it animal cruelty if you can't change your pets water every 8 hours. God help you if you sleep late or if you actually have a job. Of course, the puppy mill, which is a business, has no problem meeting this requirement. The regular pet owner, not so much.
Sally January 2nd, 2008 02:09:00 PM
Tina, you are incorrect that Tompkins County (not Ithaca) was a failure. Tompkins County is, last I heard, at 93% live exit, and the community considers their shelter to be a model for the nation. In fact, the local paper wrote a glowing review of Winograd's approach, and how proud they were of their role in developing it, just after the book came out.
The disagreement, for those who are not familiar with it, was whether keeping dogs in auxillary areas like laundry rooms (walked multiple times a day, etc) during a peak period was better than euthanizing for space. The crowding was temporary, and the animals kept that way lived instead of died. Personally, I have no problem with that call.
If I were a dog, and had to choose between being stuck in a laundry room for a week or two, with multiple daily walk, or dying - personally, the laundry room doesn't look so bad.
Sally January 2nd, 2008 02:32:00 PM
Sally, that is Nathan's explanation. The issue is bigger than that.
Local news sources would disagree that the problem was just some dogs in a laundry room for a couple of days.
But the shelter has been running out of money for years, and now local towns are dropping their animal control contracts with the shelter.
Tompkins County was never open admissions. They had a waiting list, and charged a fairly substantial admission fee which many people couldn't afford or wouldn't pay.
(That fee was selectively higher for breeds like pit bulls)
It wouldn't be so bad if Nathan would just admit to the problems, but he just denies them and still claims that Tompkins County is a model for his approach, is open admissions, and thriving. It just isn't true.
Although since these issues became public, he does appear to be distancing himself from Tompkins County and claiming he hasn't been there in years and doesn't know what is going on.
Yet on the other hand, he still promotes Tompkins County as a current success.
And then jumps into his usual mode of bashing other groups.
It just doesn't make sense.
Tina January 2nd, 2008 03:18:00 PM
Actually, the local news sources ARE where I got my information. I go to the source.
Interestingly enough, the local news sources also show a pretty different story than you suggest about the budget issues, and the local government. Essentiallly, the shelter (which also does animal control for the entire community) has been subsidizing the local government by providing animal control services to the localities at less than cost. The local governments want to look at what it would cost elsewhere before agreeing to pay more.
That is NOT quite what you imply by saying "running out of money", nor is it localities "dropping their contracts", although, given the priorities of animals in most county budgets, there is a risk they will go with the cheapest possible alternative, regardless of what that does to the euthanasia rates.
Tompkins County SPCA provides animal control services, which are, by definition, open admission. However, if you voluntarily relinquish a pet, you are asked to pay a fee.
Winograd discusses what Tompkins County achieved when he was running it. He can't control what it does now. But it's obvious that the community supports it - I have read plenty of glowing articles in the local paper, and they had an esitmated 80,000-90,000 donation specifically given to help the shelter subsidize local animal control. I notice you don't mention that, either.
The local articles I've read in the actual local paper are way closer to Winograd's interpretation of the situation than yours.
I also think it's interesting, when a shelter is at 93% live exit, that you are so focused on "the problems." How about focusing on the hundreds of lives saved? Geez, any shelter that has an animal control contract and is still at 93% live exit, deserves a brass band and a gold medal.
Sally January 2nd, 2008 04:27:00 PM
Stefani: I'm gratified to know I've contributed to getting one more reader to take up this book.
Dr. Patty Khuly January 2nd, 2008 04:42:00 PM
The problem anti-feral cat people have is NOT their impact on "suburban wildlife", whatever that is. The problems include 1) their impact on native wildlife especially ground nesting birds (and Winograd's denigration of the notion that native species ought to have special consideration is biologically unsound at the least. Carried to its logical extension, we'll be left with nothing but black rats, cockroaches and house sparrows; and 2) their impact on the property rights of people, such as destruction of gardens.
While it is true that habitat destruction is the most important issue facing birds and other wildlife, it makes no sense to ignore the impacts of feral cats, which ADD to the human-caused negative impacts. We should protect habitat AND we should minimize our other impacts, including the impacts of our pets.
TNR people want to have it both ways: they want feral cats to be wild, so people don't have legal obligations to them AND they want feral cats to be pets, so cats have the legal protections pets have. Native wildlife and the rights of people to enjoy their own property are negatively impacted in either case. Even in the most successful TNR cases, some feral cats will always remain.
I don't like the notion that the only solution to feral cats is to destroy them all. But I sure don't like giving them free rein, and rights even people don't have.
EmilyS January 2nd, 2008 05:49:00 PM
"It is really unfair for we, as humans, through our reckless development, use of pesticides, destruction of habitat, etc. to drive species (songbirds, etc) to the point of peril, and then demonize cats for picking some of the remaining animals off, because their populations have been made so fragile by OUR activities."
Stephani I totally agree with you and it makes me very sad to realize just how nasty people feel about feral cats. They are only wild and homeless because of ignorant, sloppy human beings. But then again we are entitled to decide who lives and who dies so lets just get rid of them. Its like the deer and bears that we "need" to eradicate because they have nerve to encroach on our ever sprawling suburbs. Sheesh.
Jules January 3rd, 2008 07:08:00 AM
EmilyS: TNR can coexist harmoniously with environmental initiatives. Check out my posts on TNR and the Texas plover vigilante for my solutions:
Dr. Patty Khuly January 3rd, 2008 08:58:00 AM
Sorry, that was:
http://www.dolittler.com/index.cfm?mode=search
Dr. Patty Khuly January 3rd, 2008 08:59:00 AM
Dr Patty: I appreciate your openhearted and sensitive view of this subject and your desire to see all sides. As far as I can tell from your writing, and that of others, the "best" that happens to a feral colony under an effective TNR (which most are not) is that it is "stabilized". That means there are still cats, and that means that in some locations, fragile populations of native species will be threatened, and any attempts to eradicate the cats will be met with howls (so to speak). And it still means cats that will come onto people's property and harass/endanger their own pets, and damage their own lawns/gardens. I honestly don't know what a reasonable and humane solution is, but my bottom line is that I see no justification for giving feral cats more rights to exist than others, and more property rights than people.
EmilyS January 4th, 2008 11:48:00 AM
Emily, the "best" that happens to a feral colony under effective TNR (which is happening increasingly as it is being better understood) is that the size of the colony is gradually reduced and eventually eliminated through attrition.
I don't see how not killing ferals gives feral cats more right to exist than others, and I certainly don't see how not killing them gives them more property rights than people.
Sally January 6th, 2008 09:15:00 AM
I have a question that perhaps you can answer. Don't feral cats fulfill an ecological niche once occupied by small, wild cats that have been eradicated due to habitat loss?
Barbara Saunders March 20th, 2009 02:04:47 PM
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