Vet P.O.V. Pitting birds against cats (round three)

December 6th, 2007  

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I see the solution quite simply: keep cats indoors. We need to let go of the old romantic notion of the indoor/outdoor cat -- it is just too efficient a killer. It is an introduced predator, and allowing it to roam the neighborhood (or the local wildlife refuge) is irresponsible, as it only means the cat will be hunting. During the middle of last century, we moved towards leash laws to keep dogs inside or under direct control. Today, most would consider it inappropriate to allow dogs to roam neighborhoods, hunting at will.

Anyone who claims to be an advocate of animal welfare must respect all species, and not single out cats for protection, while ignoring all the others. People who advocate TNR and cat sanctuaries are purposefully ignoring the damage cats do to native wildlife. I cannot understand the disconnect in the minds of TNR advocates between their insistence on preserving the lives and dignity of one species, while at the same time completely turning a blind eye to the killing that goes on around them at the teeth and claws of their wards. Maybe it is out-of-sight out-of-mind, as the cats are so efficient at keeping an area clear of other animals, that not a bird song is heard, nor a chipmunk seen. Maybe they just think it is "normal" for cats to eat birds, chipmunks, and the like. Maybe they just don't care.

People like the gentleman in Texas don’t like to see feral cats being shot at like wild animals. But they don’t take steps to control their cats to prevent them from killing others. I think it is hypocrisy.

I submit all the native prey species deserve as much protection as all the feral and TNR cats (if not more). That can only be accomplished by removing the introduced predator from the wild.

Marc December 6th, 2007 10:25:00 AM

Feral cats and outdoor owned cats perform a needed service for us, they kill small rodents like mice, rats and gophers. This constitues important disease control for we humans. Yes, they also kill birds, but we can't have it both ways.
Why do you think that bubonic plague hit medieval Europe? The church headed a very successful eradication program to rid the continent of "witches’ familiars". The rats carrying bubonic plaque multiplied and brought death.

In the LA Times some months ago was an article regarding a poorer neighborhood where their cats "disappeared"(read animal control sweep). The results were a huge upswing in rats in this neighborhood.

Love them or hate them, outdoor cats are needed and necessary.

Setter Lover December 6th, 2007 11:11:00 AM

Marc: I would agree. But what about...
1-those on the side of cats who suggest that keeping them indoors is not kind to their species. The gentleman in New Zealand mentioned in the article who says that we've neutered them and tamed them--if we now bring them indoors, that's the one last blow to their felinity. Or,
2-those on the side of the birds who claim eradication of *all* outdoor cats is the only way. So even if we manage to legislate indoor felinity, everyone else must go--one way or another.

I happen to think it's best for the cat to remain indoors anyway--rural, suburban or otherwise. So for me the solution is obvious. yet not so for an overwhelming percentage of cat people.

The issue I raise is that between the two groups, there's enough basic affinity among them to reach some sort of compromise. Instead, I see the issue getting further polarized with each new case that comes up in the courts or in the local press. If a group of angry individuals can easily shout down reform that comes from either side of the dispute, does it not stand to reason that nothing is getting done?

Dr. Patty Khuly December 6th, 2007 12:05:00 PM

Setter Lover: Cats may well be helpful in urban areas where rat control is a boon, but suburban and rural areas are not so grateful for the loss of their small wildlife species. Sanitation is the means of control (something we did not understand in Medieval times)--not the introduction of a biologically destructive predator. Imagine releasing a new species to kill mosquitoes or a new type of genetically altered grain able to withstand new types of weeds (you don't have to imagine, we have done such things and are kicking ourselves for it now). Such is what you propose in maintaining cats for their dubious health benefits to humanity. Their benefit to us is undoubtedly in the realm of their personal interaction with humans, not in their wanton destruction of the unwanted "pests" in our midst.

Dr. Patty Khuly December 6th, 2007 12:12:00 PM

People do get so adamant as if one solution should apply to all. It seems to me that if people move into areas where endangered flightless birds live they should agree to keep cats indoors or not at all. You get to live next to astounding scenery and wildlife, and so should do your part to protect it--or live in an area where the wildlife are either more hardy or already extinct. Then the authorities could neuter or relocate ferals and prosecute the people who dump cats, existing owned cats could be grandfathered into the system, and people could decide how to balance animal interests equitably in the future by choosing where to live based on which the value more, being near flightless bird habitat or having an outside cat. Both the cats and the flightless birds would be accorded a right to live, just not together because that--by definition--doesn't work.

emily December 6th, 2007 01:33:00 PM

Dr Khuly,

I beg to disagree, rural areas have long used cats as natural predators, think the farmer with barn cats for mice control. We have used cats for mice control, the idea of good sanitation taking care of the problem is nice but not always the whole answer. Imagine living in an old house in a rural area where food was kept in the refrigerator, in cans or plastic containers only, anything else was mice folder. We have used cats for gopher control. Such annoying creatures, traps are only maginally sucessful and I won't use poisons. Imagine going out one day to check on one's 3 foot high tomato vine and going out the next day to find the whole thing gone down a gopher hole. I was incredulous. Cats can and do serve man in a function other than pets. Respectfully submitted from an admirer of your articles.

Setter Lover December 6th, 2007 02:17:00 PM

As far as needed service of ratting, I ask: at what price? Sure cats are good ratters, and back in Medeival times, the only thing we had, but every time we try to introduce a species to perform a needed service, we screw things up so badly we realize just how little we understand ecosystems. Just look at our experiances kudzu, malelucas, Africanized bees, Bufo toads, cane toads, camels and rabbits in Australia, feral swine in the Everglades, etc etc etc. I say use other techniques to control rodents, as the mass slaughter of the cats is too high price to pay (and not just flightless birds - try sea otters, sea lions, and other megafauna succumbing to Toxoplamosis). Besides, I'm not talking about cats taming the mice and rats in our basements and kitchens. I'm concerned about the cats killing the wildlife and spreading their toxoplasma and bartonella in the wild. As in outdoors. We don't need good ratters in the forest.

As far as insulting the felinity of the species . . . I just don't have a polite response to that.

The crux of the argument is Dr. Khuly's second point, that if we are to believe we need to protect all the other species, then the only way is to bring all the cats indoors. Yes, that's Kant's Categorical Imperative. That may seem like a radical idea, but the reality is that if the cat is an introduced predator to the New World (which it is) there is no other way of restoring balance to the continental ecosystem other that removing the predator from the ecosystem.

Marc December 6th, 2007 02:24:00 PM

People who are very certain that native species trump introduced species may want to reflect on the fact that on most of the planet, WE are ain "introduced species."

I'm all in favor of keeping pet cats inside; I don't think it insults the felinity of the species at all. However, that doesn't resolve the question of what we do about feral cats, who unlike us are completely innocent in the introduction of their species onto this continent. Unlike direct extermination attempts, TNR is actually _effective_ at drastically reducing the feral cat population in an area, and relieving the pressure on other species.

Perhaps I should pass over Dr. Patty's comment about rural areas not needing feline rodent control with no mention whatsoever of the reasons cats moved into human settlements in the first place, and why the Egyptians worshipped a cat goddess. Instead I'll simply point out that many of those "other methods" so casually referred to are a great deal more poisonous to the environment than cats are.

Lis December 6th, 2007 02:51:00 PM

And to just skew this off into another direction-aren't humans a large influence on endangering species?

Habitat destruction, tall building deaths(I find a couple of dead/stunned birds each year by the building I work in), the blood sacrifice required by roads and cars-I count the 'cats kill birds' as a subset of human destruction.

So yes, lots of simple answers but no easy ones.

heather December 6th, 2007 03:33:00 PM

Setter Lover - we have natural predators such as coyote, snakes, foxes, owls & raptors, etc. There is no need to add feral cats to the mix.

Chip December 6th, 2007 03:39:00 PM

uhmmmmmmmmm Chip, I was not thinking about feral cats as much as outdoor cats that serve a purpose, some will be really tame, others not as much, but they do serve a purpose. WAY BETTER than putting out poisons that end up in our soil. Our cats are fed, s/n, and vaccinated. A happy cat is a good hunter.

Setter Lover December 6th, 2007 03:48:00 PM

I see this has become an argument over indoor / outdoor cats, and which is best. The cat is really the only pet freely allowed to roam with no restrictions. Dogs roam too, but dont have the range because they are restricted by fences. Cats climb trees and clamber over fences - they are no barrier. And they have a huge territory, if allowed to.

There is the compromise - keeping them indoors at night. But cats hunt during the day too, and fight, and get themselves into trouble. Its not much of a compromise.

In an ideal world, cats would be wanted pets, and would be kept indoors from day one, so they dont hanker to be outside. I am leaning towards outdoor cats being bad news - they are at the mercy of the weather, other cats (fighting, spread of disease, worms and fleas), traffic, dogs, being trapped somewhere and not able to escape, injury, pellet guns, predatory birds, stuck in a tree, the list goes on. Not to mention preying on wildlife.

Feral cats, and for that matter free roaming dogs, have been a problem for as long as I can remember. Feral toms spray, yowl and fight. And are often skinny, starving, sick, flea ridden and generally unhealthy. What sort of a life is that?

I can see the other side too - fresh air, sunshine, able to run and jump freely, exploring, sniffing, scenting, using their natural instincts. But I think the modern world has too many hazards out there.

Robin December 6th, 2007 05:19:00 PM

In regards to the TNR comments, I have participated in local TNR for 5 years and have seen 100% complete sterilization of most of our local colonies. All of these colonies were monitored by volunteers and fed. Our hospital also vaccinated and dewormed them and now there has been a drastic decline in numbers as the life of a feral cat is considerably shorter than your average indoor housecat. The problem, as I see it, is not the management of the ferals. Despite total eradication of some of our biggest colonies, new colonies are slowly springing up with what I refer to as semi-feral cats. These cats are being bred and dumped by irresponsible owners. The poor cats are terrified but resourceful, as cats are, and begin breeding litters of new feral kittens. You can legislate indoor cats all you want, but the only people affected will be responsible cat owners. Unfortunately, I don't ever see an end to the feral cat situation.

Meghan RAHT December 6th, 2007 07:30:00 PM

Is the cat that was stalking this bird feral? Was it a pet? I'm not into keeping cats indoors myself. It releases boredom and provides excellent exercise. I had an indoor/outdoor cat and one strictly indoors, the difference was incredible. If this is a problem for feral cats...they need to set traps. I'd rather see a species survive than a cat. Why? Cats are very numerous as it is and killing one isn't going to hurt the entire species. As for the bird, if he would have gotten away, it might have made him smarter about predators. Cats don't always hit their mark, so whose to say the cat would have gotten the bird in the end? Every party is thinking to hard about this. The cat did something natural. Birds being killed by predators is natural. The man should have been arrested and charged, and end that. Shooting cats/dogs is considered animal cruelty right? Therefore he did commit a crime. Punish him and drop the case. Then, if there are feral cats around there, trap some. There's the human intervention everyone wants.

ashleigh December 6th, 2007 08:08:00 PM

My understanding is that terrier type dogs were bred and used for "vermin control" from Roman days, so cats should not get special consideration on this account.
Okay,cats are cute, as long as they don't rub up against my leg and make that awful annoying purrrrrring sound and make me sneeze for hours. And dont't climb on my aviary. Yeah, I'm a dog person.And a bird person.
My problem is with cat owners and feeders, who tend to refuse to keep their cats under control (e.g. out of my yard and away from my aviary) or take care of them (vaccinations, neuturing, and the like).I'm always amazed at otherwise rational friends who decide to feed the "stray" cats who show up at their door. And then complain that the cats get sick and the birds disappear.
Several years ago our neighborhood was overrun with cats due to cat hoarders. Very few received proper veterinary care. After feline leukemia (I think there's a vaccine) and feline AIDS came through, most of these cats were dead. I don't want any creature to die badly, but some of them died in my yard, underneath my deck. I had to crawl under my deck to remove these with a rake to get rid of the stinking carcasses. I really wanted to know whose cats they were, or who fed them, so I could have them remove the stinking carcasses (or just dump the rotting carcasses on their front stoops.) Why weren't they identifiable? And the owners/feeders responsible?
I have to vaccinate my dogs, register them with the county, and keep them on a leash when I take them away from my house. I get fined otherwise. Cat owners and feeders should have to do the same. A carnivore is a carnivore is a carnivore. Dogs don't like being cooped up any more than cats, perhaps less so since they have stronger social instincts.All carnivores and hunting animals should be licensed and regulated, and kept under human control. What's next, ferret neuter and release programs? Python muscle relaxants?
I solved my cats in the yard problem by getting a Corgi and a Border Terrier. They love chasing cats out of my fenced yard.I haven't had to put out the poison...

hmac December 6th, 2007 09:51:00 PM

Thank you Lis for a thoughtful response that makes total sense in my opinion. I do not let my cats outside, ever and would support legislation similar to our leash laws to encourage people to be responsible cat owners. On the other hand I have done TNR for over 5 years in two neighborhoods and feel this is a decent solution to a difficult problem.

I especially love the reminder that WE aren't natural inhabitants of this country either and humans are by far the most wasteful and greedy animals here. I say let the wild animals sort it out on their own.

Jules December 6th, 2007 11:23:00 PM

We *are* an introduced species. Thank you for making my point so succinctly. Habitat destruction is *by far* the biggest killer of birds. No one disputes it. And no one's lauding our efforts for being the most sucessful killer of the environment--quite the opposite, wouldn't you agree? Cats are a distant second killer, but all research (quite a lot at this point) points to them as the second most effective decimator of birds at play in the environmental disaster we've created with our building on environmentally sensitive lands, filling in swamps, our ubiquitous electrical infrastructure, etc.

Cats, too, are our construct, at least on this side of the ocean, where very few cat species are native (and most of those are big cats). You'll find that the "Old World", where smaller cats *are* native (as in ancient Egypt in an above example), has far fewer problems like ours, reportedly due to evolutionalry adaptation of prey species there to feline hunting methods.

Dr. Patty Khuly December 7th, 2007 08:38:00 AM

Jules: Catch my TNR pos for tomorrow--I've decided it's a good time to offer solutions to the problems and (with some reservations) I agree that TNR works.

Dr. Patty Khuly December 7th, 2007 08:40:00 AM

Setter lover.. why don't more farmers use terriers for vermin control?
They are at least as effective, and rarely catch birds.

A pack of terriers could take care of your rodent problem

of course, dogs require a lot more care than cats do.....

EmilyS December 7th, 2007 10:07:00 AM

EmilyS: I have to agree. Though South Florida is overrun by rats, there is not one single rat in my mother's back yard. Her Jack is a master huntress--even at ten years old with all the cholesterol deposits on her corneas! Yet my yard still has plenty (they love the goat feed), though it's patrolled by at least three big Toms I've been unable to trap yet (these guys are smart!).

Dr. Patty Khuly December 7th, 2007 01:17:00 PM

I think the 'We are introduced species, so wild animals sort it out' is a bit of a leap in logic. I mean, yes, we non-native americans are introduced species. But what does that have to do with the here and now? The fact that feral cats are decimating native bird species in a world that has fast-dwindling open spaces? IMO, it's a slippery slope in thinking, you may as well say "well, the environment is in the shitter anyway, so why not get a Hummer!".

I think each type of environment deserves consideration. City dwellers like myself have to balance the fact that we have about 6 trees in the entire city (and once in a while when I hear a song bird it fills my heart with joy) with the hard-cold truth of asphalt yards/trash containment/rodent control. Rural dwellers are dealing with circumstances I don't really understand (some rural communities are legally allowed to pick off whatever they want with a firearm on their own property; coyotes, deer, cats, you name it) and therefore I can't really comment. The gray area is, of course, the Suburbs. Big yards, homes that are farther apart......landscaping..foliage...water features....all of these things help native song bird populations thrive while also providing refuge to migrating species and endangered species. I've seen my MIL sit on her deck (in the 'burbs) with a spray bottle in the evening waiting to nail the neighbors 3 outdoor cats that stalk her bird feeders.....I guess I applaud those that keep their cats indoors and at least consider that there's two sides to this equation. The Flintstone mentality of 'putting the cat out' and letting it feed itself off of native species seems irresponsible to me.

The world has changed and we are dealing with the here and now.

Amy in Somerville December 7th, 2007 06:36:00 PM

Amy, "Native" Americans aren't any less "introduced" in North America than Europeans, Africans, and more recent Asian immigrants, and they had a devastating impact on the native megafauna of the Americas. They were "living in harmony" with the remaining flora and fauna when the Europeans arrived because they had killed off everything they didn't "live in harmony" with. So if you want to claim any philosophical or logical consistency on this, you have to condemn them, too. Not just those of us who have some ancestors who arrived more recently.

The serious damage to the environment is being done by us, our living habits and our expansion of our own habit, not either pet cats' or feral cats' habits. Targeting the cats is pure scapegoating of a species that's been a popular choice for that practice for centuries.

The "studies" purporting to prove that cats are having a serious impact on birds--"endangered" or not--are embarrassingly superficial and lacking in anything that could be mistaken for scientific rigor. This doesn't mean that cats aren't having an impact; it does mean we have no real idea whether they are or not.

I'm all in favor of keeping pet cats indoors. With any attention to the problem at all, a cat who is not already accustomed to haivng access to the outside can easily be kept happy, active, and exercised indoors. It doesn't even stop them from being effective mousers, against the mice that do come inside--which are the mice that are the greatest problem, for city dwellers.

Feral cats are another matter. Threat to the bird population or not, people do find them annoying. But if you want to actually reduce their numbers, capture-and-kill programs are USELESS. THEY DO NOT REDUCE THE NUMBERS OF FERAL CATS. Trap-Neuter-Return programs do, very effectively, over a few years' time. So, I have to ask, is the goal to reduce the number of feral cats? Or is the goal something else?

Lis December 7th, 2007 11:03:00 PM

I can't say I don't get annoyed by the misinformed opinions people tend to hold about feral cats. Killing ferals does NOT work. Cats breed like crazy. Any time a colony is destroyed, resources are freed up to be consumed by incoming populations which would have starved otherwise. We will never completely eradicate unwanted numbers of cats; even if by some feat this were allowed, it is impossible.

S/N, indoor cats, and TNR are the only tools we have to control cat populations.

As for indoor cats, I do so wish owners would realize that owning a pet has its responsibilities. If our cats are a nuisance to the neighborhood, we are obligated to keep them indoors and under our control. This means physically and mentally stimulating your cat on your own time because protected species of birds and possibly diseased local ferals aren't now available to do it for you. Keeping a pet usually means, you know, interacting with it. Cats have been treated as a creature of passive ownership for too long; it seems a lot of problems of negligence (failing to vaccinate, S/N, and clean up cat waste, etc.) come from this. A cat's not a tamagotchi.

Agnes December 8th, 2007 03:09:00 AM

It is equally true that the numbers of feral can be greatly reduced over time with a responsible program, and that wildlife areas can be fenced and protected. Of course that requires an investment of time and money that few communities can or will make....

emily December 10th, 2007 10:26:00 AM

Just to add a link to a more positive story :)

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/accent/content/accent...

emily January 8th, 2008 04:11:00 PM

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