Vet P.O.V. Bullishly inhumane by design? On bulldog breeding and welfare

September 30th, 2008  

Add Comment34 Comments

That is a tragic story. I am so sorry for the little angel. People need to STOP buying these designer dogs (also the mini, minis) and the breeders will stop breeding them!!! Its the same situation with Pet stores. Stop giving these people business. I go around telling people not to purchase animals from pet stores like it is my job!!!!

Dana Marcus September 30th, 2008 02:25:00 PM

Thank you. I saw some elderly basset hounds the other day. One of them had a sore on its belly because its legs are so short its belly drags on the floor when it walks. I volunteer at an animal shelter and my heart goes out to all the middle-aged Persian cats that are surrendered when their respiratory ailments, the result of breeding for an extremely flat face, become too much for their owners to handle.

Stef September 30th, 2008 02:42:00 PM

Hold on a minute. I know many bulldog breeders who breed for health as well as conformation. Back Yard Breeders and puppy mills are going to do what they do, but that doesn't mean you throw the bully out with the bath water. ALL breeds will benefit if we work at educating the public to avoid pet shops, back yard breeders, internet puppy brokers and other shady sources, and if we work towards laws which make their commerce more difficult to conduct. But these are breeds which have wonderful qualities of their own which I would not want to see lost. Make the goal a healthier dog -- not eliminating the breed altogether. Labs have health problems, GSDs have health problems, but we're not hearing about eliminating them. I'm not shooting from the hip, either -- my first bully was from a BYB and suffered from health problems her whole life, skin allergies, joint problems, infections of mysterious origins, cataracts. I did all I could for her. I will never again acquire a dog from anywhere but a rescue or a reputable breeder. I'm sorry, but this solution goes overboard.

Susan September 30th, 2008 03:13:00 PM

It does boggle the mind that truly grotesque aesthetics have come to rule some breeds in the show ring and thus in the pet population. Breeding animals that cannot survive due to their deformities should be, ahem, frowned upon.

Esmee September 30th, 2008 03:33:00 PM

It's not just the 'bad breeders' who are at fault. When a Pekingese that can't even lie motionless without overheating and required surgery to allow it to breathe at all WINS CRUFTS, show breeders being out of touch with reality and obsessed with exaggerated features is just as to blame. Breed standards should be rewritten to preclude any 'design choices' that encourage diseases and suffering, and that is something the breed clubs and kennel clubs have to do.

Pai September 30th, 2008 03:59:00 PM

Now, my brain is missing (have loaned it to contractors so they can figure out how to install my network wiring) but dwarfism isn't inherently problematic. I know that my Cardis have been INCREDIBLY sound dogs, and while I do know of some who have had back problems, it's nearly always very old (or overweight dogs). (What I can't remember is if corgis are the same type of dwarfism. For some reason I think it might be the other type.) Even compared to bassets and dachshunds, though, Cardis are comparatively 'moderate' in structure. (Although I *am* seeing more extreme fronts these days, which is not a good thing.

Cait September 30th, 2008 04:02:00 PM

Responding to Paul: that's not an argument to stop breeding Pekes. That's an argument (and a damned valid one) to refocus the conformation judging away from extremes such as you described. I do not believe that has been the case for bulldogs, though their sensitivity to heat can make a show environment in the summer or in the hotter states inherently threatening.

What burns my butt is wacky people who want "mini" bulldogs and "mini" frenchies -- and the unscrupulous breeders who are eager to take their money and provide them with a dog that can barely survive. Take a look at some of the pathetic creatures for sale at www.puppiesforsalebynet.com/french_bulldog.htm But MY 4 m.o. Frenchie puppy is hale and hearty and can beat my 10 month old Boston Terrier in a wrestling match -- HE was bred by an ethical breeder. She shows her dogs, just finished one, but cares very much about their health.
Sorry to be long winded, but I love bullies, and I think there are less extreme solutions.

Susan September 30th, 2008 05:16:00 PM

"Hold on a minute. I know many bulldog breeders who breed for health as well as conformation."

I respectfully suggest that in cases such as the bulldog, breeding for conformation is completley incompatible with breeding for health. Until the standard is either rewritten or reinterpreted of course.

AdoptedAPBTs September 30th, 2008 05:34:00 PM

Cait: I looked up the dwarfism for corgis (I have a pembroke) and they do have it. It's called the achondroplastic dwarf trait but that's only if I got sources right.

Dr. K, what's you opinion on health of corgis? Will they later suffer real problems as much as other "mutated" dogs will? Or are they pretty healthy dogs, I've had my vet say my corgi was the healthiest one he's ever seen.

ashleigh September 30th, 2008 05:56:00 PM

I was looking at a website just last week of working Bassetts (somewhere in the UK, and of course I can't find the site now). It was refreshing. Yes, those Bassetts are still short-legged, but not so exaggerated as what you see in the show ring in the US, and they were very clearly functional working dogs. I've seen similar websites for working Dachshunds. Very enlightening.

I admit I find Bulldogs hilarious. Yes, some of them suffer from horrible health issues, and I wish they'd take about three steps back toward "moderate" even if that's not what's fashionable in the show ring, but I nurse a serious soft spot for them.

katie September 30th, 2008 07:39:00 PM

Here is an article, RSPCA boycotts Crufts in dispute over breeding of 'disabled' dogs.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2008/sep/16/animalwel...
Seems the UK is paying attention.

Elizabeth - from Nova Scotia September 30th, 2008 08:00:00 PM

I'd say the problem stems from our changing them to drasticly. I mean, back when they were first developed as a breed there was no such thing as mandatory c-sections because they COULD be free whelped. And veterinary medicine wasn't that advanced anyhow.

Humans playing God and changing to the extrmes is to blame. We do it over and over expecting better results and then wonder why it is all crap. Duh.

Just my two cents.

Marie September 30th, 2008 10:21:00 PM

The more I learn about dog breeding, the more cynical I am about it.

There is no use for pedigree breeding for looks. Even rewriting standards and occasional outcrossing will be useless if in the end everyone is breeding for one strict standard of conformation, because we will circle back to inbreeding like individuals to keep track of geneology. To keep health, one would have to open the stud books and throw out pedigrees. The majority of us are looking for companion animals. We can pick them based on knowledge of their parents and their upbringing, or in an adult, temperament evaluation. What does a pedigree give you? What really makes me laugh is when people go on the hunt for the perfect breed of pet dog for their lifestyle. I'm sure a predisposition for pointing, ratting, or duck tolling is exactly what today's modern family needs in a dog! (Oddly, we are much more inclined to accept a mutt cat in our lives over a purebred, perhaps owing to the misconception that their personalities and quirks do not vary as much as that of dogs'.)

It doesn't matter how "ethical" an English Bulldog, or Pug, or Frenchie, or whatever breeder seems to you; they are actively breeding dogs with impaired breathing. How is this any better than a BYB? One cannot intentionally select for traits that impair the dog and say one breeds for health.

Nena September 30th, 2008 10:42:00 PM

There's a photo of that Crufts-winning Peke illustrating a post that touches peripherally on this issue on my blog, here: http://cynography.blogspot.com/2008/09/standard-is...

I have trouble looking at it. It evokes horror every single time.

Blaming "back yard breeders" and "puppymills" ain't gonna fly. I could as easily have used a photo of any top-winning English bulldog. (The soundest English bulldog I've seen in the past ten years was a pup from a Russian puppymill, btw.)

I don't think anyone is saying "stop breeding bulldogs." What we are saying is FOR GOD'S SAKE, STOP BREEDING BULLDOGS LIKE THAT! (And again, that goes for many other breeds -- including German shepherds, where I'd take a backyard-bred animal in a heartbeat before any pup with a single "Ch" lurking in his pedigree. Difference is, there is still a gene pool of functional working GSDs, for those who know where to go.)

There are breeders in many countries who have shouted ENOUGH and are trying to regain soundness and health in bulldogs. Of course, they are scorned by "the fancy" for crossbreeding. They simply don't have the healthy genetics to work with without going outside the closed gene pool.

As for those legions of great show breeders who select for health AND wins -- well, I've already run the numbers on English bulldogs.

OFA records data on eight different genetic defects for English bulldogs.

In 2005, 23 individual English bulldogs had ANY clearance entered in that database. Not all of them. ANY of them. There's no guarantee that all of those dogs were breeding stock, either. Nor, for that matter, that any of them are really healthy. Just that each has a clearance for a specific genetic disease.

In the same year, 258 English bulldogs were declared "champions." No way of checking whether any of them had any health clearances -- if there's any overlap.

Where are those show breeders who are doing such rigorous selection for health?

In 2006, AKC registered 8,967 litters of English bulldogs. (And remember, the puppymillers and many BYBs have deserted AKC for CKC, APRI, etc., and none of the Russian import puppymill products are litter-registered with AKC.)

This adds up how?

H Houlahan September 30th, 2008 10:52:00 PM

I agree that in some breeds, breeding for conformation is not compatible w/breeding for health, and I think it's shameful. Vain and selfish, too.

anna September 30th, 2008 10:58:00 PM

Response to H Houlahan: I thought that the point of today's blog was that bulldogs should not be bred. If I misread it, my bad. But my Frenchie was health tested and cleared for hips and patellas; his breathing is clear. I have no problem with breeding bulldogs for greater soundness.

I think there is room for the preservation of the character of the breed while substantially improving its health, and your point about inbreeding is probably a part of it. I'm all for it. Bring in new blood. Terrific. But you are changing the terms of the debate now. Go back and read the blog.
I'm going to bed now. I oppose the eradication of bulldogs. I support the breeding of healthier bulldogs. That's my story and I'm sticking with it.

Susan September 30th, 2008 11:22:00 PM

The bulldog of today is a grotesque caricature of the dog of the same name that existed 150-200 years ago, before types of dogs became standardized into breeds. The bulldog is one of the most well documented types in the history of the domesticated dog, with hundreds of illustrations that show what it once looked like.

I have seen bulldogs that can move and breathe at the same time, but it's ludicrous to imagine that today's slug-like creature could hold a bull by the nose and wrestle it into submission with strength, courage and determination.

Interestingly, some fanciers of the American Pit Bull Terrier refer to their dogs as "bulldogs", contend there is little/no terrier influence in that breed and that the APBT is the only true "bulldog" left. And to be sure, historic images of the bulldog look much like some strains of the APBT today. (And yet, there are breeders of the APBT who are producing dogs that look more like the heavy sluglike bulldogs of today. Equally stupid. And equally damaging to the long term interests of the breed.)

I completely support the breeding of purebred dogs (I own 2 registered pedigreed examples myself). But the bulldog is just one example of the dreadful things that happen to purebred dogs. It's impossible to accept that breeders can know the history of breeds and contend, with a straight face, that they are producing dogs that preserve that history.. and meet the standard.

EmilyS October 1st, 2008 12:50:00 AM

Katie,

I saved that working Basset website.

http://www.albanybassets.co.uk/default.asp

I still can't get over finally seeing a nice Basset in real life. I had no idea such a thing existed!

Shelly October 1st, 2008 09:01:00 AM

I'm not sure I'm saying we should outlaw bulldogs. Mind you, I'm clearly conflicted considering that I've confessed to adoring my own Frenchies (and frankly, loving most any bulldog that comes my way) but the health problems of my own dogs (considerable compared to the average mixed breed) are magnified tenfold in English bulldogs. My dogs can run on the beach (for limited periods of time), most English bulldogs shouldn't even walk around the block past age three. So where's the line? I'm simply raising what I view as an obvious and often overlooked problem.

Dr. Patty Khuly October 1st, 2008 09:03:00 AM

I never realised how distorted the modern breeds are until I saw some 100 year old dog taxidermy specimens whilst in the UK. It included a bulldog, daschund, Afghan, dalmation and lab--none of which looked anything like the modern examples. They all looked significantly more similar to each other and sounder overall.

emily October 1st, 2008 09:29:00 AM

This is why my husband and I purchased an Olde English Bulldogge instead of a traditional English Bulldog. We wanted an EB but quickly realized how bad their health can be. Up to 60% get hip dysplasia! OEBs can end up looking like American Bulldogs for the same reason (ABs were branched off of EBs by people who moved to the US and didn't care about conformation, but functionality of the dog.)

Some breeders were concerned with the extreme physical traits of the EB and "turned back the clock" a couple hundred years. That's an Olde English Bulldogge.

Our OEBs (we ended up with two) run with us. OEBs are free whelpers and, at least from our breeder, very rarely have health problems.

Of course, there are unethical "extreme" breeders for every breed. When we were researching breeders, we did see some Hermes OEBs that are bred for large size - and ONLY for large size. Some of their obvious physical problems (mostly legs) were hard to look at.

Courtney October 1st, 2008 09:44:00 AM

Actually Courtney, you are too kind about the dysplasia rate.

Of the grand total of 410 English bulldogs EVER evaluated by OFA, 74% have rated dysplastic.

Going by the percentages, ONE English bulldog has ever, in the history of the OFA, had his or her hips rated excellent.

But -- whoopsie -- I looked him up. He is "NKC" registered. Black Champ's Maximus. So probably a crossed bulldog, or an American bulldog that was miscategorized. Definitely not contributing to the gene pool of AKC show English bulldogs.

Anyway, there's a well-established practice of pre-screening hip radiographs before submitting them to OFA -- which means that in most breeds, the reported incidence of dysplasia is certainly LOWER than the actual incidence in the population. Crappy-looking radiographs are never sent in. Ones that look like they might pass get sent. (But these breeders pretty much never check the box that releases non-passing results to the open database.)

This effect is intensified wherever the stakes are higher -- for example, in breeds where puppies are very expensive, and championships the be-all of breeding. This creates plausible deniability -- no, this dog didn't fail OFA. Not at all.

Thus, in a breed in which many thousands of litters are registered by AKC every year, only 400-some radiographs have been submitted in the past 24 years.

H Houlahan October 1st, 2008 11:39:00 AM

Emily - I'm not sure which Dalmatian speciman you're talking about, but if it's the one in the V&A collection, I'd beg to differ that it looks substantially different than Dals today.

Dals are- and always have been- defined in part by their spotting pattern. It's unique to them and it's an easy trait to loose- breeding for patched dogs quickly results in dogs with saddles and spotted 'points', breeding for dogs with too light of a spotting ends up with more deaf dogs. But they're also a remarkably healthy breed other than two issues- high uric acid and deafness. Deafness occurs in a TINY percentage of reputably bred (ie, BAER tested, bilaterally hearing (NORMAL) dogs)- apparently about 3% of the breed. Another few percent are unilaterally deaf and are pet placed. The HUA issue is another one all together- google "Dalmatian Heritage Project" for some info on that one. But just going on sheer aesthetics, they've been one of the breeds LEAST affected by fads in the show ring.

Go look here - http://web.mac.com/ravindals/Vinny/Grady.html - that's my friend's dog Grady. He's a breed champion, has a CD, and is a service dog. I was not a dalmatian fan (and I still wouldn't own one- too aloof for my taste) but wow.... what a difference betwen a well-bred Dal from a caring breeder and BYB/randombred Dals!

Cait October 1st, 2008 11:45:00 AM

Dr Khuly
if you have a regular EB clientele please consider asking some of the owners to participate in the OFA trachea data base study. OFA fees and 50.00 of x-ray charges are covered by the BCA for the first 100 dogs submitted. Participating dogs are evaluated as normal, equivical or hypoplastic.

http://www.offa.org/trachhypoappbw.pdf

http://bcahealth.homestead.com/trachealstudy.html


The goal is to develop an OFA gold standard for evaluating trachea size via radiograph and a full blown registry for trachea size. This would be an undispensible tool for any breeder of the bully breeds.

JenniferJ October 1st, 2008 12:21:00 PM

Thanks for the tip--this hasn't been on my radar screen and it's a great idea.

Dr. Patty Khuly October 1st, 2008 12:26:00 PM

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the recent BBC program, Pedegree Dogs Exposed, which has generated a lot of discussion on this topic and is the basis of the RSPCA boycotting Crufts as described in the link Elizabeth provided. I watched it on YouTube, but it's been removed. You can read about it here:
http://www.dogworld.co.uk/News/36-KC-support
http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/sto...
http://www3.imperial.ac.uk/newsandeventspggrp/impe...
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article47...

In addition to the English Bulldog, other breeds with significant health defects discussed in the program include the Cavalier King Charles Spaniel (syringomyelia), German Shepherd Dog (joint and movement problems related to the extreme topline), Boxers (epilepsy and cancer), pugs (breathing problems), and more.

Regarding the health of dalmatians, it is interesting to note that there is a gene that causes all dalmatians to have a uric acid defect that makes them prone to developing urate stones and hives. This gene has been identified and could be eliminated through back-crossing to their closest relative, the English Pointer. The AKC allowed registration of two of the back-crossed offspring in 1981, but the Dalmatian Club of America opposed the registration, and the result was that none of their offspring were allowed to be registered (http://www.dalmatianheritage.com/about/nash_resear...). As a result, dalmatians continue to suffer from this serious health defect.

I have been opposed to the breeding of dogs for looks over health, temperament and quality of life for some time now, but this program made me realize the problem is much greater than I was aware of. I'm glad that the program has generated discussion of these problems and can only hope that it will lead to improvements rather than just defensiveness from the breed and kennel clubs.

BTW, I've owned Chinese Shar-Pei since 1983, but not as a breeder (all of my dogs were placed with me as adults due to either health or temperament problems). I became horrified early on at how these dogs were being bred indiscriminately to make money, and disassociated myself from other Shar-Pei breeders and owners in the 80's. I've been lucky in that all of my dogs have been basically healthy and have lived long lives (my current dog is almost 17), but I know of people who have lost every dog they've owned to an early death from amyloidosis (my current dog's sire died at age 4 of this genetic disease). I feel my luck may not last any longer, and my next dog will not be a Shar-Pei. I can only add that I'm glad their popularity has dwindled; they are not a breed I recommend to people.

Mary Straus October 1st, 2008 03:00:00 PM

Math correction: That's 410 "bulldogs" in *34* years, not 24.

Mary Straus, have you noticed that it is rare to see purebred shar-pei at all anymore? (Maybe, because you have them, that's not so true for you though.)

Late 80's -- a pyramid-type bubble, like emu farming, with "breeding stock" going for astounding prices. (There was a good story arc in the TV show "Hill Street Blues" in which a character fell for a flim-flam shar-pei scheme.)

Early-90's -- badly-bred ones *everywhere,* probably mostly from pet stores, still a status dog.

By mid-90's, I was seeing them chained up in front of coal-patch houses.

And now -- I've seen maybe one purebred shar-pei in the last several years, but I see their mixed-breed descendants *everywhere.* Especially in rural pounds and inner-city shelters.

Shar-pei really put a stamp on their crossed offspring -- nobody else has a head like that, and it seems to be prepotent -- so they do stick out.

Is this the inevitable downward dive of the fad dog breed?

H Houlahan October 1st, 2008 03:28:00 PM

Shar Pei's can be very high maintenance in regards to their common health problems.. skin issues as well as that chronic fever and join swelling disorder almost all of them seem to have (cant remember the name of it offhand). Once word got around about their issues, people lost interest in them, I'm assuming.

In a companion dog breed, there is no excuse to create them to require highly specialized care to the point where they cease to be a good companion animal for anyone except the most elite fanciers simply due to all the issues they can have/are prone to. There's no logic in it.

Pai October 1st, 2008 05:45:00 PM

In addition to the yorkies, I also have two dogs that are part OEB (Olde English Bulldog).

The first I got from a humane society at 9 months thinking she was half boxer. After three months of constant gastointestinal problems and vetwork, it was concluded that she had 'food sensitivities' after a couple weeks of bland diet cleared her up.

Months later we ended up running into someone who recognized her, and eventually we were able to track down the owner of the litter. Her father was of the OEB type from an OEB breeder in the same state. The neighbor's dog (a JRT and sheltie mix) got in and got knocked up. It was an irresponsible mistake on both sides, the male should have been neutered and the female should have been spayed. The OEB father was healthy, but was a 'gassy' dog per the owner. He did have a lot of extra skin, the bowlegged conformation, but was not a small dog (he weighed about 100 lbs, we were told) and lacked the extremely pushed in snout. When we visited he and his daughter (our dog) ran around the yard for an hour with no issues.

A few weeks later we were asked if we could take her brother.

Despite being from an OEB that appeared to have less deformed conformation, both of our dogs are extremely gassy. When we moved across the country this summer, we spent the entire trip with the windows down to escape the smell. The male is prone to skin irritation, he appears to be allergic to some types of grass, which he spends quite a lot of time rolling around in with his sister.

Despite probiotics and good food, they still have days when we don't dare have anyone over. In fact, I worked in a dog-friendly workplace and tried to take the female to work one day, but had to take her home midday as she was turning the office into a toxic environment.

However, how many owners of other mutts and other breeds deal with minor 'health issues'? At what point does it stop being cruel and starts being chance, starts being a condition that somes occurs and sometimes doesn't? Being only half OEB, is that really the main reason my dogs have the particular sensitivities that they do?

jenn October 4th, 2008 01:09:00 AM

The BBC documentary "Pedigree Dogs Exposed" is available here:
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids....

icr October 13th, 2008 11:37:00 AM

AVI to MOV MAC

ofse July 23rd, 2009 01:39:25 AM

DVD To Blackberry Converter

terw August 7th, 2009 02:20:22 AM

Hundreds of links of london jewellery in stock,Free Gift Wrapping,Complete links london jewellery collection,including necklaces,braceles,earrings.links london store links of london,links london Bracelet links of london Charms Cheap Links London,Fast Deliv ery!linksoflondon silver range for 2009 including links of london necklaces,Links Of London Earrings,Charms,and Bracelets links of london ,links of london Bracelet Earrings,links of london Bracelet Necklaces. The love for beauty is a nature of all human beings; the love for links jewelry is a habit of the public since various smashing links of London necklaces Tiffany Jewellery.

links london September 3rd, 2009 04:33:21 AM

Thanks for your sharing.Maybe you are interested in Abercrombie and Fitch.

 

AF September 18th, 2009 01:35:22 AM

Add Commment

Your Name:

CAPTCHA Verification