Patty - I can just see you wiggling your index finger in that Latina fashion as you do this, pretty funny in my mind (or scary, depending on how you look at it).

Alex December 3rd, 2008 09:42:20 AM

Our vet gives multi-pet discount even if we bring in just one. We rarely bring in two at a time and if we do, we schedule two appts, not a shared single one. That's not good for the pets. By focusing on one at a time, we don't forget something important and we don't jump from one to the other. We'd never wait until we have two sick at once to bring them in. We did a rabies clinic once with 3 cats and 3 dogs. Never ever again. That was stupid but a learning experience. We thought it would be good to have them all done at the same time so we'd never forget who was due when. Never again.

We have taken in one dog for an appt and another for anal gland stuff. One goes to the back and the other goes to the exam room.

Regardless of the reason we bring two at a time, we'd never go with just one human.

Your reasons are valid and common sense. Most of them are geared toward irresponsible owners.

PaulaO December 3rd, 2008 10:21:45 AM

Off the top of my head, I honestly cannot remember if my vet offers a multi-pet discount or not.  For some reason 15% off sticks in my head, but I could be imagining things.

It's a nice perk, but it wouldn't dictate whether I went to a particular vet or not.

When my kitties were still with us, they were on the same annual schedule (we got them within about a month of each other) so I took them in together each year for shots and checkups.  It was simply easier than making two separate trips, and the waiting room wasn't an issue since they both were safely tucked in their carriers.

Once we did take the two cats and the dog in all at once, because the cats had their annual checkup and the dog needed an early shot (IIRC, we were getting ready to go out of town and he needed it for the kennel) - THAT was only doable because I recruited my brother to help with animal handling!

For me, the lack multi-pet discount is by no means a deal-breaker, and I wouldn't fault any vet for not having one.

Cindy December 3rd, 2008 10:43:01 AM

Makes sense to me. Can't afford it, don't have pets. And I'll bet its not only poor people that complain about not getting a discount. In my experience, some solidly middle and upper class people can be the most mean with their money. For instance someone I know who recently bought a new rug to keep her new carpet from getting dirty from her dog -- whom she will not now spend $250 on testing to find out why the dog is scratching herself bloody. Doesn't even have to do with a discount but I just can't help wondering why she got a dog when all she does is complain about it, biting, (shes a puppy) dirty and expensive.

Esmee December 3rd, 2008 10:43:08 AM

I agree with your policy and think that you have outlined your points very well as to the reasons for doing so.

The current mentality of "more pets is better" really gets on my nerves because I see the repercussions in the mental health of those animals who do not get enough attention or guidance.

These days people expect discounts for just about everything. Although we all love a bargain that doesn't mean that you get the best out of it...and just take a look at the economy...big discounts on autos and you ask why they are in trouble?

Occassionally I give added value but I quit doing discounted programs a long time ago--in fact I raised my rates and now I have clients that are more compliant, handle their animals well, and are a pleasure to work with instead of a wider demographic.

Special offers are great if you want to attract new clientele but discounts are often associated with cheap or inferior products and services--no thanks.

My current trend is that if people complain about the fee I refer them elsewhere. It isn't that I don't care or don't want the business but after you have been in the industry a while I think you get smart and cut out the pieces that don't work or give you joy.

Invevitably, the discounts or favors end up being more work and headaches than the regular clients.

<a href="http://www.arkanimals.com">Take an armchair safari with me at ArkAnimals.com</a>

Ark Lady December 3rd, 2008 10:50:24 AM

My vet offers a discount on office visit fees only, and, honestly, it wouldn't make a difference to me one way or another if he did or didn't.  If my dogs are sick, or getting individualized care (follow-ups or such), I bring them in one at a time.  I usually drop them off for their routine care (dentals and semi-annual exams and vaccinations), and so will drop them off in a group then, but since they're being dropped off, they're seen individually anyway.  (I have three dogs.)

Your policy seems perfectly reasonable.

Katie December 3rd, 2008 10:52:18 AM

I wouldn't expect any sort of discount on anything like exam time or multiple pets who are all sick (you're going to have to look at everyone individually, obviously) but I *do* appreciate being charged only a single office visit when it's something entirely routine- for example, when EVERYONE goes to get their titers done or shots when I'm taking an entire litter of fosters (or, for that matter, my own puppies) in.

Cait December 3rd, 2008 11:20:28 AM

As a small scale feline rescuer we have good success in keeping our stray/feral/TNR population nearby as we have a 240 acre farm with large outbuildings.   We have little-to-no success in finding suitable homes for them.   When my veterinarian recently died, I contacted our prospective new vet and was very up-front about 1) it being over an hour drive one-way, 2) these being generally healthy rescue animals, abeit that some are still pretty wild, and 3) discussed my annual veterinary health care budget in terms of our self-imposed maximum of 14 cats.   I asked point blank whether she felt, baring any major surguries or surprises, my budget was reasonable AND if she was willing to take us on as clients.  To me this relationship is a partnership and I will only work with veterinarians who share that attitude.

I let them decide how to schedule the time, how many she felt she was willing to see.   I defer to them in terms of when  (day of week/time of day) that appointment is scheduled.   If I have to take  vacation time, so be it.  I did ask for a multiple-cat discount, nor do I ask to double-dip on time.  I take her time, I pay what she requests.   If I receive a discount it is entirely her decision to grant it.    In this case it turns out she does.

That being said, when I have a kittywho is actually sick or injured - off to the vet by itself.  There is no need to further stress the cat, or one of its comrades, by taking a healthy animal in at the same time simply because it is convenient to me.  This applies doubly to any animal that is still in a live-trap (yes, some of them are that feral and we are committed to TNR). 

I name all of them.  I speak to and call for them everyday.  Mealtimes are consistent and we get a head count, keeping track of when the last time we saw each one was.   I spend touch  and cuddle time with every one of them who allow me, every single day.  They may not be "lap cats" but I assumed responsibility for their holistic health when I took them in.  This is how I operate, and thusly they remain current on vaccines and get annual checkups. 

I know how many horrible multi-animal owners there are out there.  I have illegally stepped onto their properties and taken their animals away from them on occasion, hence my lack of names or locations.   I guess my too lengthy post is in response to Quatro...   where I live the local "humane" society euthanized 806 cats out of 1100 brought in last year.  After learning this I called and offered to take some of those cats to our farm and pay for the neutering if they waive adoption fees.   I went in with letters of support from my vet.  They'd rather murder a perfectly fine animal than waive a fee.  My 14 seems trivial in comparison, but I know of at least 10 other farmers doing what I do... so 140ish makes our cooperative effort feel more successful.  Largely made possible by vets who do support the multiples discount and have somehow figured out how to equitably deal with Cinco.

And the closing comment... this is not an insult as I agree your business is yours to make decisions on an manage... but I think you'd fail my partnership attitude" test so I wouldn't need to "handle" your "o discounts rule. 

rescuecatsmom December 3rd, 2008 11:31:42 AM

sheesh, having MS stinks my typing bad... reread paragraph, inserting the bolded word NOT.

"I let them decide how to schedule the time, how many she felt she was willing to see.   I defer to them in terms of when  (day of week/time of day) that appointment is scheduled.   If I have to take  vacation time, so be it.  I did NOT ask for a multiple-cat discount, nor do I ask to double-dip on time.  I take her time, I pay what she requests.   If I receive a discount it is entirely her decision to grant it.    In this case it turns out she does."

rescuecatsmom December 3rd, 2008 11:39:53 AM

Cait: See, I don't even charge an office fee for some things. If I don't need to examine the pet the office fee is waived. For example, if I've recently examined your pet and all I need to do is provide vaccines or follow-up on some bloodwork I won't charge a visit at all.

Dr. Patty Khuly December 3rd, 2008 11:40:22 AM

rescuecatsmom: Of course there are always exceptions. But I call them "charity" not "discounts." For serious rescuers whose agenda and approach I'm in synch with? Those are services I'll often give away. But should anyone expect that I do so? No more than you expected your current vet to take you on as a client.

Dr. Patty Khuly December 3rd, 2008 11:45:29 AM

I nearly always bring more than one dog with me to the vet. But.. my vet doesn't give me a discount for it. I do it because it is convenient for me -- and as a professional dog trainer, I have very well-behaved dogs. One will cheerfully hold a sit or down stay while the other gets an exam, innoculations, blood draw or whatever. The fact that this clinic lets me stay with my dogs during everything but surgery is one of the main reasons I go there. They don't do this for everyone -- and I cherish a privelege I worked hard to earn. My vet does give me a discount on services she renders to the foster dogs I take in. That's a big help to the orgs I volunteer with and I don't ask for more.

SmartDogs December 3rd, 2008 12:20:35 PM

The vet I went to for years gave me a 15% multi pet discount. Unfortunately one of the vets on staff at the clinic did something I consider to be unethical and I believe in voting with my dollars. I switched clinics and pay considerably more (I miss the discount when I bring all 7 in for heartworm checks), but know that my money is not going to support unethical behavior. So a multi pet discount is always welcome but not a deal breaker for me.

Brenda December 3rd, 2008 12:27:35 PM

I've never expected discounts for multiple pets. I have 4 cats and for most of the last year also took on care of one of my mom's old dogs. Last time my cats went for annuals all at once. Without me asking, I think our vet cut me a break on the office visits, as I recall it. Maybe it's because I simultaneously scheduled $1k worth of dentals. Plus I was getting bloodwork and vaccinations for all 4, which was not discounted. I never asked or expected to get a break but it makes me grateful when they do it, and generally, I spend so much that they seem to do this for me nicely sometimes.

I agree that fewer animals means better care. I think for cats, 2 is the perfect number. I have 4, and 3 of them were recommended for dentals last year. I asked the vet to prioritize who was in the worst shape, and those two got the dentals. The third will be up next, but the delay for her is not ideal. Every time I think "OK, now I can take her in" someone else has something (my mom's old dog with kidney failure; my youngest cat eating thread and having ER surgery two weeks after losing the dog . . . ). So, her dental money keeps getting spent on someone with a critical emergency.

If I had 2, I would have fewer competing needs to manage financially, so . . . she would have had her dental by now. $$ for their health care is a top priority for me financially, but even so, sometimes it gets so expensive that noncritical stuff has to wait. I definitely know I don't want to add to the household.

Stefani December 3rd, 2008 12:38:47 PM

For regular checkups I bring both cats in at the same time. Once the carriers are out - they both get worked up - so its easier on me and them. Plus, since I have to take a cab to the vet, it saves me some $. The vet gives each their own exam time so I expect to be charged for two exams - that's only fair.

2CatMom December 3rd, 2008 12:47:49 PM

Having 1 more dog than is totally comfortable for me has been a problem, but I'm lucky in that I work part-time at my vet's, so get the employee discount. Before I started there I was going to a clinic that gave me a 15% multi-pet discount, but their prices were much higher to start with, so while I really liked 'my' vets (2 of the 3), when they moved on and this job opened up, things worked out much better. Even if I didn't work there the prices would be less at this vet than before, so although he doesn't usually give discounts to regular clients, I'd still go there. And not that I want any of my dogs to pass on, but when that happens I will have to wait until I'm back down to 3 before getting back up to my comfort level of 4.

Kate December 3rd, 2008 01:23:30 PM

Wow, I think some of your reasons are resonable, but mostly from your perspective as a business owner or veterinarian. From the perspective of someone who ends up with more animals mostly because they need help ~ strays and ferals ~ your attitude & policies are the reason my animals don't visit vets more. When did it ever stop being about helping animals (and appreciating those who do also) and start being more about the time and money? So grateful for the vet we've had for years, who was always reasonable when it was needed and NEVER preachy. So sad that he has passed away and left his practice to be taken over by people who've changed his long-standing policies to reflect an emphasis on the bottom line, less on people trying to help animals instead of dumping them at the local shelter. I am not one of those people who ignores a cat hanging around, starving and hoping for food, or waits for a litter of feral kittens to die or disappear. You want people to care for and help animals, but then by God, they better be able to pay your fees or else they aren't worthy pet owners. Before you start assuming about me, my cats (born of strays) & dog are spayed and neutered, so mine aren't a part of the stray problem ~ but I have helped the stray problem in my area without relying on shelters & euthanasia.

Kat December 3rd, 2008 01:41:23 PM

The only time I've ever received a discount was a 'Good Samaritan' discount for a rescue I was housing until the local no-kill shelter could take it. I would not expect a multiple pet discount. I also would not expect a "multiple kid" discount for my human children at the pediatrician, either. Cats, dogs, chickens, children; they're all mine, and I expect to be billed accordingly. We've never doubled up on visits. Wait - I amend that - we did once bring two dogs in. One needed routine labs and the other a physical. I brought them in together at the receptionist's suggestion. It worked to my advantage not on the bill, but my Akita tolerated the lab work  much better with her "brother" in the room.

I will say that it is frustrating at my particular vet to be charged for an o.v. even if we were recently in and are just getting a rabies or something. I get that charge even if the vaccine is administed by a tech and we never see a vet. That's annoying.

Melissa December 3rd, 2008 01:42:06 PM

Kat: I know my tone may sound harsh and I apologize for it, but recall that what I bristle against is the expectation that what I do is inherently less worthy of remuneration because I love what I do. Should I not be allowed to pick and choose the charity work I do? You do, I'm sure.

When it comes to veterinary medicine, we vets are more likely to be accused of being uncharitable  or ungiving when we don't offer discounts and free work, even when we know that our clients are doing good deeds for their communities. Problem is, they don't always see the extremely needy patients we DO treat for nothing--or the huge cuts we offer to our TNR clients.

But again, this is "charity work," not "discounting" in my book.

The irony of this perception of vets as uncharitable is that almost all the vets I know do more daily charity work than almost any other kind of professionals I know (and we don't write it off, either, as lawyers, accountants and human docs do). There's just too much of this kind of work to go around so we have to be careful about how we dispense our charity services.

As my boyfriend likes to say when I spend my time doing freebies, "Patty, at some point you need to have some money in the bank to go and buy groceries." That's something I think we can all relate to.

Dr. Patty Khuly December 3rd, 2008 02:08:21 PM

I do bring in my pets together sometimes - it is one trip less after all. But I book consecutive appointments and I pay for each of them. After all, I'm paying for an examination & a consult on each animal. It wouldn't occur to me to get a discount for bringing in more than one. I do expect the vet to take the full appt. time for each animal....

hornblower December 3rd, 2008 03:13:18 PM

Back when I was younger (and nuts), I used to schedule double appointment slots and bring both dogs in for wellness check-ups together. My husband always came too, so we each had one dog. I don't recall it being cheaper, though. If both dogs got an exam, I would not expect to pay for one exam or office visit or whatever you call it.

Then, again, we're strictly a two-dog family because two dogs is what I can handle (emotionally, training, attention) and also what I can afford (since mine tend to have expensive things crop up).

I would be curious, though, where Ark Lady draws the line when she says, "My current trend is that if people complain about the fee I refer them elsewhere."

Would someone with cost concerns (due to the poor economy, for example) also get referred out? I'm thinking more of a worry, like "Gosh, I'm not sure I can afford that right now," vs an out-and-out gripe.

Roxanne @ champion of my heart December 3rd, 2008 03:23:09 PM

The only discount I have had is with my rabbits. The vet gives a discount if you bring 2 of the same species at the same time. I have a bonded pair of rabbits who would go in together even if only one need a check up (less stress on both of them to stay together in a stressful situation). I bring my single bunny at a different time. The discount is only about $10 total.

I don't get a discount for my dogs. I do bring them together, but only because they are now on the same schedule for shots. A few years ago, they had different schedules and went to the vet sepeartly. They don't seem to charge for an exam with shots (it appears to be included), but the cost is no less for 2 dogs than 1.

I don't' have an issue with handling my pets. The rabbits are in a carrier and the dogs are on leashes.

I do not expect a discount as it is my choice to have the pets that I do. I do however appreciate that my rabbit vet does offer a discount. It sames me time, money and stress for my bunnies.

A vet should not be obligated to provide a discount to clients. Doing an exam for free just because there are 2 pets is not fair for the vet. You are doing the same amount of work as should be paid for it. Teachers don't get paid less if they teach 2 kids for the same family. Stores don't charge you less for buying a cart load vs a single item. Any discount that you give should be your choice..

Kate December 3rd, 2008 03:23:55 PM

I agree with you wholeheartedly, Patty!

I've worked in vet hospitals since I was sixteen, and I'm now halfway through my first year at vet school (exams are soon, ahh!). We actually just had a lecture in our "Personal and Professional Development" course, that highlighted this very fact. We, as veterinarians, are asked to do superhuman things, and, simply because we deal with animals, we are expected to do it for free. We are asked to do many of the same procedures human doctors do for people (only we have to learn at least 10 times as much, as I am finding out in preparation for the first exams!), only we don't have the backing of insurance companies to help our clients afford it.

As a whole, I think the majority of vets would love to work for free if we didn't have to worry about, say, buying food, (after all, I doubt anyone goes into general practice for money) because the interest of the animal is our main concern, but we shouldn't be expected to. After all, most of us will have SO much debt after school that we need all the money we can get! Also, just like with human medicine, it IS a business. There are plenty of nonprofit organizations that will do the minimum requirements for dirt cheap or free to people who really need them, but if clients want quality medicine or someone who really and truly knows what they're doing, they should expected to have to pay for it. It's not being mean or cruel, it's being realistic!

I do agree also that in certain cases (like an owner catching the stray animals s/he lives near and bringing them in to be neutered), that might deserve a break, because after all that benefits everyone, but the vet (or whoever runs the practice) has the right to decide, NOT the clients, because usually the clients have no idea what goes into the running of a vet practice in order to keep it in the black.

p.s. I LOVE your blog, it's so nice to actually know that people do get through vet school and go on to be great vets. It gives me hope that I might be able to pull through it :)

Tara December 3rd, 2008 03:31:28 PM

Tara: OK, so maybe not a GREAT vet (especially considering that I misspell things in my own supposed mother tongue--I fixed it so don't go back to check) but a MOUTHY one, yes. ;-)

Congrats on [almost] completing your first semester. Anatomy lab...shudders...

Dr. Patty Khuly December 3rd, 2008 04:45:51 PM

Excellent post, Dr. K. Not surprisingly, I agree with you - pets are a personal, financial, and ELECTIVE responsibility. I especially get frustrated with "breeders" who expect a whopping discount when they bring a litter in - nope. YOU decided to create these pups, YOU pay for their care, period. I do sympathize with those who take in strays or ferals, but I would still be irritated if they expected a discount. Either be prepared to take on their medical costs as you would any other pet you chose to bring home, or turn their care over to those who are willing to take on the cost (rescue-type agencies and non-profit organizations) or to those who are subsidized by the government to do so (shelters). You're not doing the animal any favors if you can't afford to take care of it, either, whether that be food, shelter, or medical care to whatever extent. Be okay with your choices...if you decide that you can either afford to take in one stray cat and care for it completely or provide food for 15 stray cats - and then choose to feed the 15 - you'll eventually have to deal with the fact that some will need more care than you can give, and that's that. That's your tough decision to make when it comes to the cost of their care, not someone else's, and you shouldn't base your estimations of what you can afford on the expectation that someone else will pay the difference. Be okay with the level of care you're able to provide, or don't take on the responsibility. That being said...I'm a sucker for strays, ferals, basically whatever comes walking up to my door. I'm up to two dogs and five cats, and it's definitely my maximum. Any more are going to get meals, a deworming, flea/tick preventive, basic vaccines with enough boosters/time to kick in, and then a trip to the local shelter - it's the best I can do for them out of my pocket. For my own, I get discounts on their food and care because I work at a clinic, and while some may think it's hypocritical of me, keep in mind it's one of the reasons I stay at my job despite my ridiculously low wage. Before I worked in a clinic, I never would have dared to ask for a discount (or "charity"), but I was awfully glad if I got it! One last thing about your veterinary staff...and I believe Dr. K has blogged on this, too...those who are rude, condescending, or who mistreat the staff will typically be presented with a bill for full and fair charges. Make us like you, and we're more likely to feel charitable. :) This applies no matter the number of pets you own or bring.

anna December 3rd, 2008 05:08:41 PM

I suppose charity work is one way to look at it.  When my former and (hopefully) current vet calls and asks if I can accomodate an animal who is fine other than the behavior problem of urinating on everything, then offers a year of vaccinations "on them" I still view that as a partnership rather than my being the recipient of someone's charitiable business write-off.  They don't struggle with the the emotional burden of doing a truly unnecessary euthanasia, I don't care if a cat pees all over my machine shed.  The animal in question is served by both parties.  Of our current eleven, four are euthanasia avoidance animals.

rescuecatsmom December 3rd, 2008 05:54:03 PM

I think overpopulation leads some people to confuse private pet ownership with animal sanctuaries. I could easily provide a good, caring home for more homeless animals if it weren't for vetinerary costs, but I'm not a sanctuary that should be supported by charity or subsidization -- I'm a private pet owner whose pets are person possessions, acquired by free choice and at private expense. (Well, two of them are; #3 is a charity case that someone else adopted and then left here, poor little guy.)

deidrel December 3rd, 2008 06:29:25 PM

I get SOOOOO irritated at people who assume that because you work in veterinary medicine, you will take in any animal, or do any veterinary related work for free!  I had someone call me asking me to take her golden retriever because - her boys had gone to college!  Grrrrrr!  Others call asking me to come over and administer the vaccines they just purchased at the farm store, but don't know how to give.  Grrrrr!  Others expect me to give up my weekends to care for their animals, totally free!  Grrrr!  One of these people knows to call my husband to ask, because she's learned I will say no!  He always says yes, so I make him care for the animal!  I had one client from work ask if I would take her dog with health issues, because 'You could afford the tests, special food, and medicines, since you get a discount'.  Grrrr! (and, I don't get a discount!)

And, why is it that vets are expected to work for free?  Their education wasn't free!  They have to pay for supplies they use, taxes on their building, and pay wages to those they employ, and even, sometimes, pay for some groceries!  Has anyone ever asked their children's pediatrician for a discount, or to work for free?  Or asked the grocery store for free groceries because you have several children?

Sassy December 3rd, 2008 07:06:36 PM

I certainly agree with not scheduling more than 1 animal during the same appointment time--someone is going to get short-changed that way--but I don't necessarily agree with this being either client/pet-friendly or a good business practice. For example: I have 5 cats, and am willing to shell out absolutely anything when one of them gets sick (one cat racked up $2500 in medical bills this summer, and I spent another $1K on 2 dental visits). However, because my vet charges a $120 annual exam (per cat)  plus vaccine charges when I take my cats in for their shots, I elect to get my cats vaccinated at a local Humane Society clinic, and generally only take them to the vet when there's a problem. There's no way I'm paying close to $1000 annually for everyone to get their vaccines--if I did that, I wouldn't have any money left over when someone got sick. However, if my vet offered a multi-cat discount (or charged less for the annual exam), I would probably choose to get the annual vaccines there. So my point is that, by not offering a multi-pet discount, my vet completely loses my business for certain procedures. It's obviously up to you to set the rules for your clinic, and up to me to decide whether I want to be a customer, but I have to disagree with you on this point.

Sarah December 3rd, 2008 07:09:43 PM

Ughhh.. I'm sorry to laugh.. We're running into a problem with people wanting discount on copays if more than one patient in a family is seen.. Not only that.. when more than one person comes in, you run the risk of missing something.. or basically.. the mother tells you child #1 is sick, and when you exam child #2 who has mild symptoms.. you find the bigger problem.. I presume things are going to get worse.. and more people will ask for discounts..

barri December 3rd, 2008 07:25:18 PM

Dr. Khuly, You added an important concession...sometimes you DON'T charge for a followup appointment or perhaps slip in a service for NC. I haven't received a multiple pet discount in over a decade. I believe if I brought in 3 or more at the clinic I go to, a discount may be applied. That will never happen, my max is two and that depends on which 2, often it is one at a time.

However, at my high point, I had 8 dogs and 2 cats...in my eyes that is like an instant client/patient times 10. Should I expect a little lee-way? I certainly do not count my pennies on any given visit, on the same token, I don't expect to be nickled & dimed by my visit, either.

I could comfortably care to the fullest extent those 10 pets, now I have 1/2 the number and like everyone else, my income has NOT kept up with the price increases (across the board) and those 5 take up a MUCH greater percentage of my net income. Often a weeks pay is doled out in ONE visit.

Hopefully, this doesn't sound like a rant, because truthfully, I got the pets, it is MY responsibility and I need and will see it through. Hopefully, no one thinks because I do, that it means I have an endless stash of cash squirreled away!

Almost forgot, I noted in a clinic newsletter that 501 3C's receive all services at 50% discount...while I am all in favor of giving rescue/shelter people a break...who is making up for that hefty break???? B. Albright

Pocket's Story from NH December 3rd, 2008 07:44:04 PM

barri: I find that very interesting. I never thought to wonder how human physicians would handle this issue because it seems so obvious they never would. It's amazing to hear what people will ask for when the financial pressures mount. And no, I don't necessarily blame them for trying, just as I don't blame pet owners for electing a vet that offers discounts. It's actually quite sad and a scary sign of the times. Thanks for the perspective.

Dr. Patty Khuly December 3rd, 2008 07:49:44 PM

One of the most feared lines a client can utter: "I know I only had an appointment for Fluff's shots, but I brought Chubs too, can you just take a quick peek at __________ while we're here?"  

OH NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO...

...followed shortly by: "What?!  I have to pay for TWO exams!?"

No multi-pet discounts where I work - we book each animal in a separate appointment slot.  We give the client twice the time, they give us twice the money, and no one gets shorted.  Few clients have greater than 3 pets, and those that do are usually the "vaccines only, kthxbai" kind (not ALL, just most), so offering discounts just doesn't make financial sense from our end.  

beth December 3rd, 2008 07:51:21 PM

Barbara: I think you raised a fine point. As long as the prices are fair and justified, shouldn't they be level? I made this point before but I'd like to underscore it with the following observation:

I find that our practice's prices are great compared to some of the pricier places, many of which offer discounts. I believe that what ultimately happens here is that discounts only serve to raise ALL the prices for any given hospital. Though discounts may help those who qualify, people aren't always getting the deal they think they are. In many cases they're lured into believing the price is right because of the break they're getting, when really they're paying more than what would be considered a fair price elsewhere. 

Yes, I know it's a shocker but I'm going to go out on a limb and say this: "Discounts" are sometimes nothing more than marketing. They're not always there to ensure you get a better price or "more humane" financial consideration for your pets.

Dr. Patty Khuly December 3rd, 2008 08:09:17 PM

Dr. Patty, Thanks for your comments & responding to mine. I am obvously disgruntled and sad at the loss of our vet & at the abrupt rise in charges we were faced with. I know there are plenty of vets who do what they can to help overpopulation, and lots that offer low-cost spay and neuter. But I am not one who has ever purchased a pet in all of my 37 years of owning cats & dogs - only adopted strays and/or ferals. Currently only have one dog and two cats ~ fyi, to the poster asserting I considered myself an animal santuary provider. Of course my cats have a better life than they were faced with as strays! Frankly, diedrel, most "sancutaries" or shelters live on the edge of razor, just a few steps from being closed down for lack of charity or subsidized funds. If more people did take in the rejects instead of searching for that elusive or prestigious purebred... well, maybe we would not have the problems we do, and animals would not need to die unnecessarily. But I digress =) Vets absolutely should be renumerated for their skill & efforts. Just wish I knew of a vet around me who charged fairly. Animals lovers abound in my friends/family circle (even a vet tech sis in-law and a friend going to school), just no actual vets - yet.

Kat December 3rd, 2008 08:29:29 PM

How timely. i just today called my vet because my rescued pitbull needs another tooth pulled. Currently I have 4 dogs- my chosen standard poodle, the rescued pitbull, the rescued pyrenees mix, and the fostered chocolate lab. I didn't go looking for the two rescues- they found me. And even though I knew it was gonna be tight, I couldn't turn 'em away. I have never, including today, asked for any discount. Tho today I did make it clear it ain't about saving the tooth as I can't afford that- we need to pull the sucker. I figure that is acceptable to a dog that was formerly on a chain with no food, water, or shelter. I won't turn away a dog in need. But now, all I can do is give that dog a good meal, a day of love, and a trip to my vet for a humane death. I don't know that I could take one to the shelter- they are so crowded, noisy, and in our area, not too healthy.

agadoresmama December 3rd, 2008 08:29:49 PM

I have to admit that we sometimes reduce the fees for people that don't have coverage.. I think it's an instinctive thing.. More of evaluating the situation.. We have an office in a socio economic disadvantaged neighborhood.. It's not always easy evaluating more than two at a time.. It gets pretty funny.. when a mother of eight walks in.. We pray they aren't all being seen.. I didn't mention that we don't go by appt. We also have another office on Long Island.. that is more civilized, and has appts. I am a bit guilty of treating Socks conjunctivitis with Vigamox, as I wanted to avoid the vet bill.. which is more than what we charge for a human visit.. I don't take a courtesy.. as I can afford it..

barri December 3rd, 2008 10:06:04 PM

Dr. K: I completely agree with you, "marketing" is used everywhere. Somewhere, somehow, a certain amount of income has to be pulled in to cover the expenses, simple as that! And that may vary from place to place on services, medications, etc.

Gosh, it annoys me to read that the desk personnel has the ability to influence the bill...every place I've ever been to, it is the vet that fills out the "charges" to go onto the invoice

And though I have no doubt that in some locales, it is a (wrongly) prevailing feeling that a vet should work "for free", but I assure you that is NOT the case in my area. I read comments like that and wonder where they are coming from and where do they live???

Lastly, why is it often commented as if "vets" are the only professionals offering pro bono work, around here, we read about all kinds of charitable work from : human medical & mental health professionals & clinics (particularly elderly services), legal assistance, accountants, real estate professionals (holding charitable drives, etc.)and yes, though not "professionals", USPS employees are some of the most 'generous' group of folks I've ever known. Barb Albright/NH

Pocket's Story from NH December 4th, 2008 12:05:05 AM

ugh! all those money issues give me a headache when i just think about steering back on the vet school track. it's hard to be a vet!

sarah December 4th, 2008 01:06:32 AM

I have 2 small dogs that I rescued as puppies and who are now 10 years old.  I could afford them when I rescued them, but I had to go on disability about 5 years ago.  Even so, they were priority.  I lucked out - they are mostly healthy, so I could afford the annual costs, and the occasional vet visit for odd things - a cheet grass up a nose, a suspected seizure at one time, a dew claw problem. 

Then someone dumped 2 kittens in my car in the hot parking lot.  I paid for getting both of them fixed, and their shots, determined to re-home them, but I love the damn darlings.

Then, a friend in a wheelchair couldn't handle her 4 month old golden retriever.  She asked if I would take her and train her to stop jumping and to stop pulling on the leash.  I took her, fully intending to give her back, because I live in a assisted living senior housing, and am supposedly allowed only one pet.  The dog spent the day with me, and I took her back to her home at nite time.  After a couple of months, it was obvious the dog preferred to be with me, and my friend just couldn't do the disciplining/training required to calm the puppy down.  It was discovered that  shared the same birthday as my deceased baby son.  It was also discovered that she senses when I'm about to have a seizure, and also when I have pain due to MS - she will bring me a empty pill bottle (she likes to play with them), which reminds me to take my meds.  So basically, she's turned herself into a true service dog, and I am training her to pick up things that I drop, to help me when I fall, and to help me balance when I'm wobbly due to the MS. My landlady is a peach and just looks the other way, telling herself that no one she knows in the building has four pets.  "Denial" in her case is a lovely thing.  :-)

When I took the kittens in to the vet to get fixed and vac'd, I told him I couldn't afford 4 pets, but I would pay whatever he charged me, as long as he accepted monthly payments.  He was fine with that, and I truly don't know how much he charges for an office visit, much less the surgeries, shots, etc.  Or whether he gives discounts.  For the annual stuff, I do take in the two dogs together, and same for the two catsI They are all well behaved, which is another reason the landlady can look the other way - she never gets complaints about them.   I don't know what he charges for what - I just pay what I've promised to pay monthly until it's paid for.  I've never missed a montly payment.  Again, I simply don't know what he charges - I just pay because I'm grateful that he accepts my limitations and works with me.

When I took the golden retriever in for her shots and spay, the vet was vexed with me, knowing I can't realistically afford FIVE animals!  I told him that I would have to make payments for any emergency stuff, but if there was ever anything over a thousand dollars, my wheelchair friend would pay it upfront - that was part of the conditions of me taking the dog off her hands.  He is also her vet for her small dog and cat, so he knows her, and knows she is financially well off.  He accepted those terms, and I'm thrilled.  But after seeing what the dog does for me, how smart she is at 6 months, and seeing that it is obvious that I can benefit from a service animal, he has since told me that he gives discounts for service animals.  The receptionist told me later, that my Annie is their first service animal - I think he is just kind, and I will forever take my business to him for that reason.

The first two little dogs literally saved me when I got dx'd with MS - I was forced to get out of bed to care of them, when I would have preferred to shoot myself and be done with it.  The kittens brought back laughter into my life.  The gold retriever makes life easier for someone who has a seizure disorder, MS, and severe Rheumatoid Arthritis in my hips - she can pull me out of bed when I can't move and am stuck.  I adore each one of them, they are well trained, well cared for, and well loved - hence my landlady, neighbors, and vet are more than willing to work with me.  I take 2 separate walks a day, one with the little dogs, and one with the golden, for a total of 3-4 miles a day.  I believe it is obvious that I am an excellent pet owner, so everyone is happy to help me out, and I make it obvious how much I appreciate their help.  I've referred countless pet owners to my vet, I bake cookies for my landlady and neighbors, specifically because I know how lucky I am to be able to have the five animals with me.  And it helps that the animals are so well behaved, including the cats - people love to watch them do their tricks and play with each other.  (It helps that the cats think they are dogs!) (And they keep the apartment complex free of mice)

He could be the most expensive vet in the area for all I know.  Obviously, he is worth it.  I never asked for any discounts, and I always pay what I've promised to pay monthly, because vet bills, pet food and supplies are priority in the budget, even before my grocery costs. I am currently saving up money to have everyone chipped - I don't expect monthly payments for "luxuries".

So I am curious - would I be considered a problem pet owner to you?  Am I just lucky as all get-out? :-)

Sorry for the long comment.  I'm an idiot about my animals!

Laurie December 4th, 2008 04:56:56 AM

Barb,

I don't think Dr. Khuly was saying that other professionals don't do pro bono work, but rather that most people don't realize that vets do it just about every single day.  And vets are often the ones harangued about not doing enough of it on top of it all.  How many of those mail carriers and accountants are told that they don't do enough charity work?  I can imagine that it gets old to be so underappreciated.

I've only had one issue where I was upset about not getting a multi-pet discount.  I had made appointments for two ferrets, fully expecting to have two separate appointments and pay two exam fees.  Well, they decided to cram both of the exams into one appointment and then still charge me for two full exams.  I was upset twice-over because I felt like my pets had been short-changed and I felt like I had been overcharged.  From then on I only scheduled one pet at a time even though it was less convenient for me.

Ingrid December 4th, 2008 07:07:08 AM

My vet does give a multi-pet discount. For routine annual/vaccinations I do take in the 2 dogs together (leashed,of course, and NOT on flexis), or the 3 cats (in separate carriers). They block off a slightly longer appointment time, and I get charged for only one office visit, but no discount on vaccines or meds. I never wait until I have more than one if there is a health issue, injury, or illness. In fact yesterday I took my older Lab to my vet for what I thought was an abscess on her leg. Turns out that they think there is an underlying tumor that is causing the swelling/drainage and I got an estimate of approx. $600 for exploration/excision/biopsy. This will be done immediately after she finishes her course of antibiotics and is no longer febrile, although I was told it could wait until after the holidays if I chose to wait. Will an extra $600 at this time of year make an impact on my budget--of course it will. But would I wait just because it would make things a bit tighter over the holidays--NEVER!!! I appreciate the discounts; they were freely offered and gratefully accepted, but I would never ask for or demand them. It is my choice to have the pets I do, and I accept that there is a financial obligation that must meet to care for them. I pay my bills immediately and in full; but I suspect that if I encountered an unexpected financial hardship, they would work with me as far as payment goes since they know I would not ever avoid payment (we have an almost 20-year relationship).

Shellie December 4th, 2008 07:27:03 AM

Ingrid, lawyers and accountants work under ethical rules that require pro bono work. The major firms have their own standards which often require more pro bono work than would satisfy the ethical guidelines. And you only ever hear about it when a lawyer or a firm takes on a really high-profile pro bono case for which they may get as many or more verbal brickbats than bouquets. Running down lawyers, and to a lesser extent accountants, as greedy, immoral, dishonest, and ethically hopeless is just a given of general public conversation.

Veterinarians are generally regarded as the good guys.

And regardless of whether you, or Dr. Khuly, or Anna, or anyone else, approves of the fact that I have three pets (a dog and two cats), or that Laurie has four pets and a service dog, or whatever, they're our family, and we have to find a way to cover their costs somehow. Yes, it's our responsibility--and precisely because of that, other things being equal, what we pay for their medical care has to matter. I don't mind paying fair prices, and don't shop for the "cheapest" vet; I do mind being nickeled and dimed.

Dr. Khuly says she took it for granted that human physicians would never have to deal with issues of patients wanting discounts, etc., and is surprised to learn that they do. I find that astonishing and revealing.

Lis December 4th, 2008 08:22:55 AM

I went to a vet that charged one office visit no matter how many pets you brought in. I too vote with my dollars, and I now go to a vet who charges an office visit for every pet you bring in every time. I love my vet. I believe he is intelligent, knowledgable, and I am willing to pay for that knowledge and the care he give my cats. I live an hour away from him, so yearly exams are with my entire clan. Fortunately they are all cats and all in carriers and all get along so exams do go well. I am compliant, I follow all his advice, and work with him to come to a course of action when ever one of my pets are under the weather. I do not take advantage of his time, if I have to make an appointment, I make sure it works for him, and if I have an emergancy I don't throw other issues into the mix - and I certainly wouldn't wait till late saturday to call up and say one of my cats hasn't been eating all week.. I do not ask, nor do I expect a discount of any sort, but after giving him almost $2000 in a year I would like a little courtsey something.. a good client is valuable, and should be worth throwing a discount every once in a while to make them feel appreciated..

Connie December 4th, 2008 11:17:55 AM

Dr. Khuly, how about a post about being a veterinarian, and friends/family looking for free care? (Although...didn't you already do one on that subject?) My good friend (since 8th grade) is a veterinarian. When she bought her first clinic, she was so proud to be able to offer me virtually free care, and only charged wholesale prices for any products I needed. While that was great...in a way, as her friend I also wanted to contribute to the success of her clinic. I would've had to seek veterinary care somewhere, so I was more than happy to pay fair market rates to my friend, rather than a stranger. She eventually sold that clinic and was employed by another clinic. When it came time for me to pay the bill there, she always felt a need to apologize for not being able to give me the same discount she had at her own clinic. I always felt a bit bad, on both accounts. I never tried to take advantage of her when she made the rules, and I certainly didn't expect any favours when she was working at a clinic where someone else made the rules. Like many of the commenters, I'm happy to pay whatever it costs for competent veterinary care. It's what is expected of anyone taking on the responsibility of pet ownership. Yet I can't help but wonder why there is this expectation of free, or discounted, veterinary care? I've honestly never expected any discounts. But, then again, I'm the kind of person who doesn't like anyone doing favours for me.

Marjorie December 4th, 2008 11:35:58 AM

Re: "how about a post about being a veterinarian, and friends/family looking for free care" Just to point out, this happens to all professionals. My friend the doctor is constantly getting hit up by her buddies for on-demand primary care, especially at odd hours. Lawyers get asked for free legal advice all the time. Because I work in IT, sometimes people erroneously assume I know how to fix their hardware problems. (I don't!) I think that anyone who is in a professional services profession gets asked for free consultations, if not free services, by their friends and family. Vets aren't uniquely put upon in that way; many of us have to deal with that.

Stefani December 4th, 2008 12:05:11 PM

Lis, I certainly didn't say anything about whether I thought you should own multiple pets.  At this time I, myself, own 4 large dogs, a ferret and a tortoise.  I do understand what Dr. Khuly is saying about being able to provide for multiple pets, but at the same time I don't think that my choice to have all of these animals should entitle me to charity from my veterinarian.  It's my choice and part of the responsibility of taking on these animals is paying for their health care.  My vet didn't decide to take them in, I did.

Ingrid December 4th, 2008 12:16:16 PM

hehehe...Stefani... :-) You know what I naturally have to say... This is Dr. Khuly's veterinary blog, so I wouldn't expect her to discuss the trials and tribulations of being a medical doctor, lawyer, plumber, etc. ;-)

Marjorie December 4th, 2008 12:22:25 PM

There are some people who just expect that since their pets aren't human, their care should cost less and they don't care to consider any practical realities that conflict with that view. I hear all the time, "This dog/cat/rabbit was a stray/rescued from someone else/classroom pet" and since it didn't cost them anything to get, it doesn't have the same value as a 'store-bought' pet. Or it's "just a hamster, etc." so it's not worth care that costs money. A cavy just came in that needs calcium supplementation and when told about vitamins, they actually said, "Will it need this forever, 'cause that's more than I want to spend. Can I give it milk?" I also was told by a client, when the vet was out of the room, that if their dog, who was a HBC case, didn't make it, they wouldn't pay, "'cause why should we if Duke dies." Luckily Duke was okay, but they still haven't finished paying their bill (they paid half and seem to think that was enough) four months have gone by without any payment at all. And people wonder why vets don't - often CAN'T give discounts.

KateH December 4th, 2008 12:48:23 PM

"Dr. Khuly says she took it for granted that human physicians would never have to deal with issues of patients wanting discounts, etc., and is surprised to learn that they do. I find that astonishing and revealing."

Lis: Don't you? I've never asked for a discount or a break from a human doc (though, interestingly, I have from a lawyer). For some reason the managed care system shortchanges them enough, I tend to think. The very fact that the third party payment system exists seems to negate the impact of any discounting--except when it comes to co-pays, which I never in my wildest dreams would consider negotiable.

My son's orthosontist? That's another matter. No, I didn't ask for a discount, but I did expect some readjustment on a future treatment for some obvious sloppiness...more on that one tomorrow.

Dr. Patty Khuly December 4th, 2008 03:54:07 PM

Ingrid, It was not my suggestion that Dr. Khuly was referring to pro bono work; it was the other posters that suggest it is "only a veterinarian" that gets hit up for all these freebies and that is just not so. It is expected of almost every professional and large companies, etc. to provide some charitable work. Gosh, it is good PR, gives a sense of value to oneself and provides for others. Churches, social groups, you name it.

The post is about providing "discounts". And discounts can be provided to good customers in many forms. Free follow-up, few extras at no charge, etc.

While again, I reiterate that I have not taken advantage of a multiple "pet discount" clinic for well over a decade, on the other hand, years ago, yes, indeed there were concessions from the clinic-owner vet that cared for those 10 patients. Midnight C-section, stitches on a cut eyerim after closing, slipping in an appointment that wasn't a dire emergency, but not comfortable with putting off. There was thick and thin : I overlooked some things I wasn't entirely happy about (and silent) and other circumstances made up for it.

And let's not forget, I never boohooed over the bill and it was ALWAYS paid in full, no waiting. Am I a good customer? That is why to my last day on earth, I will NEVER understand the desperation of setting up the cruelest and ludicrously expensive SCAM of ALL with my dear Pocket. I can't fathom it, that money would have been more than quadrupled by now....CRAZY, CRAZY greed and sickness. Barb Albright/Chester, NH

Pocket's Story from NH December 4th, 2008 07:32:44 PM

Huuummmm

okay I suppose if I am completely truthful I do expect some discounting. I am happy with whatever I get, it is depending on pet, procedure, etc... But I don't expect it because it's my vet. I expect it more because of how much business I give them. How much I spend there. Which on average for each year of basic animal care is about $4000.00. Some years double that if there are surgery/dental/etc...

If I spent that much anywhere each year I would expect some sort of perk.

LorriM December 4th, 2008 08:09:15 PM

Dr. Khuly, tens of millions of Americans have no health insurance, or find the copays (which after all are intended to discourage "unnecessary" use of medical services) genuinely difficult to pay. So, yes, they ask their doctors for discounts, or one copay when they're bringing in multiple family members, or outright free services. The difference that manage care makes is not that doctors don't get such requests, but that they're less likely to be able to say yes, because manage care contracts frown on that kind of thing.

It's not something that happens only to veterinarians, or that automatically indicates a lack of respect for your profession.

Lis December 4th, 2008 09:58:05 PM

I'm nearly certain that it was "managed care" when I typed it. Both times.

But not 100% certain, since, by gum, there it is: "manage care." Both times :(

Lis December 4th, 2008 10:00:34 PM

It's not the insurance companies that frown on reducing the copays at the patient request, it's the IRS that requires us to report it as income ( that we got it). and take the loss.. I had an incident that the gyn gave me a courtesy, and didn't charge me the copay, and I ended up getting a bill from her billing company.. I contacted the company, and it was more of an effort than it was worth.. Fro $25 I can be a sport..

barri December 5th, 2008 05:00:45 AM

Many doctors are employees of managed care organizations, and don't have the authority to waive fees or give discounts, even if they want to and even if they would be willing to deal with the associated hassles.

But that doesn't mean that they look like "just employees" to their patients, who will still ask for discounts or waived fees or whatever if they're under enough financial pressure themselves.

Lis December 5th, 2008 10:37:08 AM

Since the subject strayed a bit, I can add that my health provider has informed me that if I'm ever short or in need of waiving the co-pay to please speak up & it will be done. It was extremely thoughtful and though I doubt I will ever need to take advantage of the offer, there are surely other folks that would need to.

I feel utmost fortunate to have health insurance, even though for decades I never took advantage or needed it. I can't imagine at my age not having it.

And as far as respect goes...I can't express how much I have for these professionals, Barbara Albright

Pocket's Story from NH December 5th, 2008 05:45:08 PM

Hmm, I guess I'm in the minority here. I have two dogs and I do frequently bring both of them in to see the vet at the same time. My reasons for doing so: --I drive nearly an hour to see this veterinarian, because I trust her immensely, and she does an excellent job of taking care of my pets --Because I don't drive, I always have a second (dog-savvy) person with me who holds/controls a dog --My veterinarian *adores* my puppy. The one time I brought in my older dog without the puppy she expressed disappointment at not being able to see my puppy, so I continued bringing him --My older dog sees her quite frequently for chiropractic readjustments (typically monthly/every two months) and also gets lots and LOTS of fatty deposits that we are trying to keep "mapped" (uh, two new ones in the past month and she has something like 22 total). Also my puppy is battling some food allergy problems that we are trying to keep track of. There is a lot going on and the more frequently she sees my dogs, the better it is for everybody! If I did not bring them in at the same time I honestly would feel like I am taking up way, way too much of her time even though I was paying for the service. There was a time that even with combined visits I was STILL visiting her almost every 10 days over a 2 month span. Had I not been combining visits I would've been seeing her for close to two hours a week for a period of eight weeks. She has other things to do! It certainly has helped financially to be able to combine visits but I like to think that I am doing her a favor by not taking up a ton of her time. I make my visits as short and easy as possible by coming up with a list *in advance* of my concerns for each dog and I let the front desk know if I think the appointment is going to run late or be on the short side so they can book accordingly. In addition to all of this I make sure to just be a good client: show up on time, avoid problems in the waiting room, thank the vet/tech/receptionist, never complain, don't cancel appointments, send Christmas cards, and otherwise try to be agreeable! :)

Cat December 5th, 2008 09:08:47 PM

Cat, add me to your minority.  :O)

We have three dogs, two cats and two parrots of our own - and we're currently on the low side.

We also rescue, and currently have three rescue dogs and five rescued parrots.  People keep referring to "registered" rescues AND charities, which is funny, because there is no "rescue registration."  We are registered with Petfinder, but we do not have non-profit status, simply because it takes too much time and money and would reap few benefits (along with many other administrative issues).

My vet charges ONE office fee when we go in, as he does with ALL his multi-pet clients.  He also provides a 10% discount across the board if you have three or more pets. This is not to promote large pet households, but rather to attract valuable clientele.  After all, we spent about $32,000 last year on veterinary bills.  Could he remove the incentives?  Certainly.  Would we find somewhere else to go?  Probably.  How many single pet households would he have to find (barring serious illnesses) to make back that money?

Because of the discounts, we put off all "maintenance" stuff like vaccinations or basic checkups until someone has to go in to get looked at for something specific.  There are always two of us, and while I handle whoever it is who is being looked at, my husband handles the travel back and forth to the car to pick up and drop off finished and "next in line" pets.  The easy stuff goes first, then the tricky stuff so I have less to focus on.  Because we're there once a month, minimum, I really don't find it that difficult to concentrate or "focus on each animal" (seriously, in high school did you only take one course per semester?).

This practice also saves us travel time and gas, as our clinic is an hour away.  The savings are astronomical.  Our last BIG visit involved three dogs and a cat.  Three were vaccine visits, and one dog was a senior blood panel, a full thyroid panel and a year's worth of soloxine.  The bill?  $350.  In town, it's $100 each pet for vax alone.  Not to mention, the clinic is open 24/7/365, I get to see the same doc every time, and they have state of the art equipment on site (laser surgery, ultrasound, etc - a rare find in our area).

I guess what I'm trying to say, Dr. K, is that while I apparently fall under your "shouldn't own pets if you can't afford them" category (it should be mentioned that my guys receive the best medical care available, eat grain free canadian kibble, homemade or raw and receive only humane grade treats/chews/raw bones - organic whenever possible, and the parrots are fed a home cooked fully fresh organic diet - basically no expense spared) simply because I seek out discounted medical care for my insanely high yearly vet bills... your attitude towards multi-pet households and the inference that those of us who have more than 2 or 3 pets are somehow emotionally disturbed is seriously insulting... and your attitude would immediately remove you from my list of potential veterinarians, discount or no discount.

So... I guess I'll be taking my money elsewhere.  Which you may not have a problem with (after all, this is all about "your choice") but the clinic owner who provides you a place to practice may think otherwise in a shrinking economy where money starts to talk a little louder... and when he realizes that such incentives can attract wealthy (albeit apparently unfit due to the number of paws in my home) clients that, certainly in my vets case, become the cornerstone of the practice.

Coming next month: Two dog neuters, a spay, a dental, a possible amputation and yup, a vaccine visit thrown in for good measure.

Kim December 6th, 2008 05:06:12 PM

Re: "After all, we spent about $32,000 last year on veterinary bills"

Wow, Kim, I thought I spent a lot. You definitely have me whupped for expenditures in 1 year alone.

Stefani December 7th, 2008 05:03:27 PM

Last year was a bit high, we had several dogs who required intensive care such as amputations, ligament repairs and ongoing testing for various disorders.  We specialize in "special needs" and "unadoptable" dogs, so our vet bills tend to be higher than most.  And of course, our own guys are mostly special needs as well... you know, those ones who show up and then just never leave? ;O)

Kim December 7th, 2008 06:15:37 PM

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fifa December 8th, 2008 04:10:25 PM

Kat - I'm sorry -- my post wasn't intended to respond to yours! I'm sympathetic to your perspective, and I think your animals are better off with you than they would be in a sanctuary -- I think you *are* serving the public good. Although they are rescues, I don't think that I'm serving the public good in any particular way by owning my pets. I was going to have two cats anyway, and I'd have been delighted to support a good breeder with my money if I hadn't been just as delighted to adopt from a shelter. If I were to provide a home to more pets, I would definitely need to find some way to make more money or to pay less for veterinary expenses. Veterinarians do contribute to private ownership of homeless animals when they provide free services -- I just agree with Dr. Khuly that this is a free act of charity when it's done. Fair prices is another matter -- it really comes down to a question of trust on both sides. I hope you find another vet who will work with you!

deidrel December 9th, 2008 11:41:31 AM

Hmmm. So much activity, over a simply statement of policy. Well, not entirely simple, but certainly clear enough. Honestly, I cannot recall if my vet has a multiple-animal discount, or not. Since none of the cats like the dog, well, the dog comes in alone. And since each of the cats has it's own reaction to the vet (or any automotive travel at all), and two of the three reactions are... Difficult, well, I bring them in individually. Not as a statement of purpose, or from a point of better care, but because that's all I'm prepared to put up with - one at a time. On the other hand, I do have an argument with thesis Cinco; Subsidy. Everyone makes a visit. Everyone pays for their visit. The basic visit cost is always the same, even if there's a 'more than one pet' per visit rule. I was going to be bringing my pet in *anyway,* and I was going to be paying my basic office visit fee *anyway* so it doesn't matter, one way or another, if somone else is bringing in one, two, or a dozen - I'd still have been paying the same basic rate. Why do I, specifically, care if someone else's costs are less? It isn't going to lower MY bill! And, IMO, the apparent discount vanishes in light of the extra management that goes into hauling five critters to the office at once; That's too much like work, for me. Nope - I'll keep on hauling them in one at a time, and remain ignorant of any possibility of a mutil-animal-per-visit policy; It pays off in my peace of mind and simplified logistics. MM

MaskedMan December 11th, 2008 03:28:55 PM

I have never asked for a discount, but whenI was dx'd with terminal cancer and was unable to work my vet only charged for treatments of the dog I resued that had stress mange (poor thing). IThey were wrong I am alive, and I still recommend this vet to all my family and friends. Not because of the discount, but because of her compassion

chemogirl December 12th, 2008 05:05:14 PM

"Cuatro: I believe most pet owners do a far better job of caring for their pets when they only have one or two pets." I could care less if you discount or not, but this generalization offends me greatly. I'm sure the ARA who are pushing for lower and lower pet limits are happy to find a veterinarian such as yourself.

envchem December 12th, 2008 07:54:56 PM

I can't see choosing a vet based on a few bucks discount because I bring two cats in at once. But for some people, it's in their nature to be pleased about getting 'a deal.' I agree that it would be a nice perk but wouldn't at all affect my choice of a vet. Curious tho - since you brought it up - as a business owner myself, do you have a sense that your policy is hurting your business? WOndering if you are one of a couple of small animal vets in a smallish town and the other(s) do offer a discount.

Karen January 7th, 2009 11:29:34 PM

well! i have never been offered a multiple pet discount from my vet...regardless, there have been times when i've brought both of my old lady cats in for the senior checkup and vaccines...i had a really good relationship with my vet and she knew both my girls very well...the only problem we had was when bee gee was wandering around meowing while she was trying to listen to tapatio's heart...i would never have considered being charged for one office visit...they just scheduled the visits as two back-to-back visits! which is fine, it was just a matter of transportation for me...usually i would bus it to the vet, but if i could get a ride, i'd bring them both in! i think if i had 2 dogs, i might bring one at a time...the waiting room would be a bit much trying to control 2 dogs!

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hood July 24th, 2009 07:35:36 AM

I have never been offered a multiple pet discount. But I believe this would be a wonderful thing. At the age of 27, I have no kids and no husband and never plan on acquiring either one. During college, I began raising my firest boxer. I did receive discounts while being a student from both my hometown vet and the vet I used at college. This was a life saver since the boxer had many allergies and demodectic mites as a puppy. Since then, I got another boxer for both mine and my first boxer's enjoyment and companionship. The result: vet bills for the second boxer were covered by the amount I saved to replace items destroyed by separation anxiety, the companionship solved the speartion anxiety. Boxers are very social and active animals. They stimualte each other mentally and playing with each other provides more excercise than I could give them myself. I recently had the great pleasure of rescuing aother 5 year old boxer who needed a loving home. He came from a very loving home and good life (his owner still comes and visits whith him regularly. Their young son was attacked by a neighbors dog, therefore making him terrified of all dogs. I felt that this dog deserved just as good a home as he had been raised in and shouldnt suffer or not live in just as good conditions as he did before. Then my mom divorced and had to move in with me due to lack of money bringing her two beloved mini schnauzers. Bringing number of household pampered, loved, inside dogs to five. My dogs eat grain free premium food that I consider high quality, and recieve all vet care from a high qulaity vet. I dont expect a discount, but man it sounds nice. My point- there are good pet owners and bad pet owners. This mainly depends on their responsibility in my opinion. There are an astounding amount of animals euthanized each year, and probably a larger number suffering neglect, abuse, abandonment, starvation, or just have owners ignorant of the pets needs, negatively impacting the pets quality of life. The key to helping this problem is spraying/ neuturing pets to prevent unwanted animals and restricting breeding rights. All of my dogs were spayed/ neutered as soon as they could be. I never paid less than two hundred dollars per dog for this procedure. Do vets not realize that most people cant afford this fee for one animal and that inorder to prevent pet overpopulation they must come to realize than animal welfare is more important than the wad in their pocket. I understand your position. You should not give an animal hoarder a discount or a person raising pits covered in scars from fighting for having a lot of animals or a breeder. But how about people who are doing the right thing such as small rescue groups or someone like me who has multiple dogs due to kindness and compassion? The alternative to my animals lifestyle could be horrible if they were not with me.... Do you not believe that these type of owners deserve a little break? And you can tell these type of owners from ones who do not deserve the break and should be discouraged from having more than one pet if even having one at all.

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AF September 16th, 2009 08:51:14 PM

I'm late finding this blog, but I want to coment anyway.  Yesterday one of my dogs had surgery to remove a suspicious mass, and the bill was about $550.  A lot of money, but a precious dog.  I really didn't think too much about it until I got home and looked at the itemized bill.  Under "multi-pet discount" I received a grand total of $2.31.

Talk about adding insult to injury.  Thanks, Dr. Beck.

Chris October 22nd, 2009 03:56:09 PM