Vet School 101 Walking the walk: On joint pain, weight loss, muscle atrophy and exercise in old dogs

August 28th, 2009  

Add Comment51 Comments

Anyone who's experienced arthritis themselves should know that exercising an arthritic joint makes it BETTER.  I have some (very) early arthritis myself; sure, there are a few things I can't bear at all, but if I get stiff, the thing to do is MOVE MOVE MOVE.

People know that the brief discomfort as an arthritic joint starts moving will ease after a few minutes of using the joint, but pets don't have that kind of reasoning ability.  So it's our job to move them through those few minutes; they'll benefit right away, and for the rest of the day.  Letting an arthritic animal lay still due to the pain will only make it worse; getting them to move will help immensely.

Galadriel August 28th, 2009 10:45:30 AM

It would be so much easier if people didn't allow their pets to become fat and immobile to begin with.  <sigh>

Yet I can't tell you how many people have expressed sympathy to my dogs when they find out one of my dogs is over 12 (sometimes even over 8!) and is still walking with me, doing agility, or herding sheep.

It doesn't matter that we've reduced the activity to an age appropriate level.  Its that we "force" them to exercise at all.

It doesn't matter that our dogs generally live years longer than theirs, with much less pain and distress.

Sad.  And even sadder, perhaps a sign of the times.  We may be modern people, but we still see fat and inactive as a sign of wealth and success.

 

Wendy August 28th, 2009 10:48:01 AM

Dr. Khuly, thank you SO MUCH for this post.  I've been lurking for months, reading every post and I appreciate your point of view and the information you bring to all of us.  I have two dogs, one a very svelte, healthy, active 25 lb. Boston Terrier and one grossly obese Pug, both 7 years old.  The pug was a healthy 27lbs (he's a big boy) at age 3 when I moved to Los Angeles and he stayed behind with my ex here on the East coast.  When I returned two years later he had bloomed to 39lbs.  We began sharing custody again and I have managed to get about 6 lbs. off of him through twice daily walks, at least one of which is usually 20-25 minutes plus a very regimented feeding schedule (he likes to steal the Boston's food when I'm not watching).  I'm still trying to get him down to a healthy weight, it's really hard.  Last week he started limping very slightly and I took him to my vet who seemed somewhat unconcerned, said to rest it, gave us rimadyl and that he'd probably need surgery on the knee as the bones are 'grinding' (and yes, the vet IS concerned about his weight and said it's contributing to the issue).  My impulse, though, was to put in some more gentle exercise time!  I started on some glucosamine but we haven't been doing our walks this week.  Thanks so much for the above guidelines, they are so very helpful.  When I mentioned acupuncture my husband scoffed but if it helps him stay mobile enough to exercise so he can lose more weight, why not????

Sonya August 28th, 2009 11:34:42 AM

With 2/3 of people so terribly over weight, it stands to reason pets are, too.  Statistics show that thin people with fat friends become fat.  Misery loves company.

I get a lot of gas from fatties because I refuse to buy in.  Unless people have a big stick hanging over their head - lose weight of lose your job- they don't. 

So, fight on, my dear.  If a small percentage listen and follow, you will be successful. But, look at the bellies of the people who have fat pets....

 

Carolyn August 28th, 2009 11:46:18 AM

As someone who had a horrible back pain problem that I could not get under control - coupled with going along with an overzealous doctor who insisted I was going to die if I didn't have my thyroid irradiated away when I was 27 - I have the lucky (hahaha) dogs who are thin while I am overweight.  Knowing how much it hurt to do anything other than going to work, getting through the day, and coming home to eat while lying on the couch (to let my back stop spasming), I understand people transferring that idea to their pets.  Luckily for me, it was very easy to keep their weight down by not overfeeding.  It's much easier to only give X amount of decent food to a dog than it is to be in too much pain to stand and cook good food, and so choose snack foods and pop to eat while reclining, which, coupled with a broken metabolism, caused a huge weight gain over two years time. 

It really has only ever been possible for me to feel better by decreasing food intake and increasing movement.  If people keep feeding their pets too much, their pets will struggle and when people see that struggle, instead of decreasing the food (and NOT by using R/D!!!), they give up completely.  It's a tough sell, but I do think it's easier to feed a pet less than it is to feed yourself less.

KateH August 28th, 2009 12:14:27 PM

I do believe that until the pet food industry sees major reform and the store brand is no longer like McD's drive thru for pets, people will not be able to get the big picture.

LorriM August 28th, 2009 12:43:38 PM

Thanks again for keeping this topic on the front burner! We stress to everyone at Tripawds that keeping canine amputees fit and trim is of utmost importance for their continued mobility and quality of life.

 

tripawds.com August 28th, 2009 12:59:15 PM

That's really great advice. I believe prevention is key. But if the pet is already overweight, that's not a reason to quit. It's an opportunity to turn things around. My dog Geppetto is always struggling with weight, but we never gve up. Sometimes I give him so many carrots his poop comes out orange. But now he's more active than ever. Swimming id great exercise, and my dogs swim every day. If you have the chance to go swimming with your dogs, I would recommend it. It's fun and better for joints.

 

Daniela Caride

www.TheDailyTail.com

Daniela Caride August 28th, 2009 01:29:37 PM

I recently adopted a 16 year old, 5 lb. Chinese Crested Powderpuff dog. Tyke was surrendered to rescue when his owners divorced. He is in very good health for his age and is an absolutely wonderful little dog. He is deaf and he has a luxating patella. The knee does not appear painful, but he does have a rather stiff looking gait. Tyke absolutely loves to go for walks. My question is whether I should let him go for the 1 mile walks I take my other dogs on or just take him on shorter walks? I already supplement him with fish oil. Would glucosamine help him?

Susan G. August 28th, 2009 05:38:50 PM

Dr Khuly, you are sooo right about exercise.  I have a 11-12/yr old GS female.  Her hips are not the best and she has developed  2  calcified spots on her #13 #14 disc./vertrabrae areas  of Sponolitis.  Jilly's vet told me it's  slow growing since her first spot was found over a year and a half ago. She was getting stiff and so her vet now has her swimming in a therapy pool for dogs.  The Total Dog Spa in Oceanside, Ca.  (for those of you interested, check out their website www.thetotaldogspa .She loves it, goes every week and does her laps with a doggie  Phys therapist.  She gets 15 min walks every day and takes her Adequan~ and Tramadol if she gets sore.  Jilly's muscle tone is amazing these days.   She is full of energy , playful , strong,  healthy, and Happy Happy, ~~ and mom is getting HER exercise walking her. No laying on her rear for her!

Thanks Dr Khuly for telling it like it is!!

Quality of live is all important !!!!! Gotta see that sparkle in their eyes!

Nancy Makowski and 'Jilly'

Temecula, Ca.

nancy makowski August 28th, 2009 06:13:38 PM

See, I struggle much more with the opposite dilemma. How much activity restriction is enough for a (very) active dog who is injured and/or has joint problems? I often feel like I am immensely increasing my dog's suffering and lowering his quality of life by *not* letting him go crazy running and jumping and wrestling. What's the trade-off between happiness now and length of recovery time, or even ability to be active later in life? If a vet suggests crate rest for a month, for a dog who is normally fetching or running for 30 minutes to hours every day, does it have to be strict crating? Is two months of no fetching or running but allowed to roam the house and go on leash walks almost as good? Not as good but better than no rest? useless? Better than strict crate rest because it keeps him sane and prevents him from inventing new forms of energy outlet like leaping straight into the air repeatedly every time he's let out of the crate to pee?A dog who wants nothing more than to tug, fetch and run all day long is only so entertained by stuffed kongs and the like after awhile (and you can't feed very many stuffed kongs to a crate restricted dog anyway, without them gaining weight!).

More generally, people here are making comments about arthritic joints feeling better after exercise. For at least some dogs I've seen, this is true immediately after exercise, but then this is followed by much increased stiffness and soreness after post-exercise rest. Again, for a dog who is willing to absolutely go all out, pain be damned, how much do we try to save them from themselves? Sometimes I feel guilty for every frisbee I've ever let my dog catch in the air, knowing how the leaping will affect him later, or how much cumulative damage he may be doing to his body, and sometimes I feel guilty for trying to remove or restrict pretty much every activity he loves.

CompetitionDog August 28th, 2009 07:15:59 PM

I have been trying to find a way to exercise 3 dogs I have.  Is it okay to train a dog to use a treadmill?  I have been reading on the internet about it.  Walking them myself really won't work because of where I live.  Has anyone tried this?  I worry that as they age they will get heavy and lose muscle tone if I don't figure out a way to exercise them.   

Jan August 28th, 2009 09:18:33 PM

Dear Doc,

Thanks for the wake up call. My 14 year old bichon has had 2 back surgeries and is now very arthritic.  I've been letting her "rest" because walking seems so hard. This I find out is not doing her a kindness. Thank you.

Mariele August 28th, 2009 09:38:21 PM

Susan G. If he tolerates the walks well, he's missing out if he doesn't get them. Contrary to popular opinion, small dogs often need far more exercise than the big guys. And YES! Glucosamine is great (basic, even). Just make sure you get a high-quality brand from a reputable lab. These products are not FDA regulated like drugs so i makes a difference. 

Dr. Patty Khuly August 29th, 2009 06:51:55 AM

CompetitionDog: Ah, the catch-22. Immediately post-op or post-injury, the rules change. A month is the typical slow-down period. But depending on the injury (such as a cruciate), return to normal activity (if it's a vigorous kind of athletic activity) can take up to 3 months! Nonetheless, dogs with these injuries and lengthy down-times will recover their muscle tone afterwards. Follow your vet's advice and if you're not buying into it 100%, seek a second opinion from another specialist––preferably a surgeon who has an interest in rehab medicine.

But I agree. It's a stressful position to be in for a normally active dog and owner.

Dr. Patty Khuly August 29th, 2009 06:57:36 AM

Jan: A treadmill works. Safety is the issue (as when dogs don't take to it well and go careening off the edge). Nonetheless, i've had many successful clients train dogs to this method (once, even a cat who thought it was great fun to play on the treadmill while it was running). If you're curious as to how this might be achieved, consider hiring a creative dog trainer for assistance.

Dr. Patty Khuly August 29th, 2009 06:59:58 AM

Thank you Dr. Patty.  I never thought of hiring someone to help me train them but I will certainly do that and will let all know how it goes.  Maybe someone who has a treadmill will give it a shot.

Jan August 29th, 2009 10:35:04 AM

Dr. K. I for one, even though very underemployed at the moment, would be interested in you being able to get a different (better) spam filter, even if I had to pay a subscription fee to read your site.  I understand you not wanting to do that, so everyone can read and comment, but what is it about your site that gets these morons, when the other 30+ sites I visit regularly don't have them?  This is SO annoying!!! 

K August 29th, 2009 10:36:11 AM

Jan, please don't use a human treadmill - they are too small.  Also, the sidewalls on dog treadmills are an important safety feature not found on 'people movers.'

KateH August 29th, 2009 10:38:19 AM

Lilly was diagnosed as moderately dysplastic via radiograph at about 26 months of age.  No symptoms, though experts could detect a hitch in her gait at times.

She was already an operational SAR dog.  What to do?

Keep working her.  Moderate exercise every single day.  Glycoflex when that came onto the market, years later.  Buffered dog aspirin in old age.  And not an ounce of extra weight -- vigilance over her diet every day of her life.

Lilly retired from SAR at age 11 1/2 -- a year or so later than most orthopedically sound GSDs manage. Years longer than her OFA Excellent GSD friend, who was allowed to get fat and then couldn't work any longer at age eight.  And we kept up with the moderate exercise, nutraceuticals, aspirin, and weight control.  She had a contented and active retirement.

Lilly died of hemangiosarcoma at 13 1/2.  She got around on those arthritic hips until the last day.

H. Houlahan August 29th, 2009 10:42:58 AM

If you don't have natural water available for exercising or worry about your dog in natural water, check www.caninewatertherapy.com for warm water swim centers for dogs.

kabbage August 29th, 2009 11:14:28 AM

CompetitionDog, do you live in an area where there are veterinary rehab specialists? If so, seek out their opinion. (Ask around among your competition friends.) They often are into dog sports themselves and know what we go through with rehabbing an injury. (There are canine physical therapists now too.) And, no, if crating the dog results in "vertical air" upon release from the crate, then crating is not the thing to do. When my vet gives me the crating advice, I always ask what the intent is. If it's to restrict their activity, I'll leave them in an ex-pen during the day (not as confining as a crate) and have a leash attached to them (and me) when I'm around. Crated only at night.

Once upon a time, I had an endurance horse prone to pasture accidents. (The horse could run 50 miles without incident or injury and would hurt herself playing with her buddies.) I got the advice of "stall rest." Um, nooooo... I'm pretty sure she'd be more likely to injure herself further while trying to dismantle the barn than she would if put in a small paddock near a quiet buddy or two.

 

Deanna August 30th, 2009 03:28:16 PM

Thank you KateH.  I have been looking at the dog tread mills and some of them look promising.   if by chance I do use a human one (only with a trainer) I would configure some kind of sides and for it for sure.  But I will only use the human kind as a last resort.  Thank you again.

Jan August 30th, 2009 07:38:10 PM

I don't have time to post much at the moment, but wanted to thank everyone for their various pieces of advice. Part of the problem is that we're currently resting a thus far difficult to diagnose back or leg injury (may be soft tissue). I've spoken to several different vets at the practice we go to, and the advice for exactly what "rest" means has been a bit...mushy. One vet basically said I should keep him from running around off-leash and eliminate fetch and frisbee, but could do leash walks, jogging and swimming, while another said that for the first month I should basically not allow any activity off-leash at all. Not sure where tug and wrestling with our other dog fit into that either. On the one hand they're generally lower impact, but on the other hand, there's a lot of twisting potentially going on. The next step is to go to see a specialist for further sorting out, but our current vet(s) wanted to see how far "rest" gets us first.

CompetitionDog August 30th, 2009 11:50:35 PM

CompetitionDog: Ah, the definition of rest...maybe I'll do a post on that one. 

Dr. Patty Khuly August 31st, 2009 06:53:15 AM

I have an 11-1/2 yr old Germn Shepherd female.  Her hips are not the worst, but not the best either, and she has arthritis in her spine. Even a touch of slow growing  (thank goodness) Spondolitis/arthritis in between 2 discs and vertrabraes which can make her sore.   

Dr Khuly, I so agree with you about exercise, Adequan, proper diet  and weight.  All important. There is one other thing that helps get the dogs up and moving when they are stiff and sore and do not want to move around. TRAMADOL pain med.  Used for arthritis and pain, same med used for people. And no, it is not pricey for a client's pockebook at all and safe.

I hate it when people say 'time to put my dog down', doesn't want to move around anymore.  The real reason is it's easier for the owner to be lazy and not get their dog taken care of properly and out there movin'. So there dog becomes a 'throw away doggie' and dumps the euthansia on the vet and does their 'tear thing'. Such bad behavior and lack of caring an doure laziness on the part of so many pet owners.

My  Jilly takes a low dose of Tramdol when she has problems, sometimes 2 weeks at a time or more if needed, and all those arthritic symptoms go away and she gets he rexercise in which keeps her muscles in good shape.   Low dose Tramdol does not seem to cause constipation and it does not upset her tummy at all.   She feels good, bright and happy, so she  wants her walks and I get her therapy swimming in every week also.  Hey, for an 87 yr old lady, she does better than some 5 yr olds I've seen.

With Kind Regards and keep up the great work on your site!

Nancy Makowski.

Nancy Makowski September 4th, 2009 11:36:55 AM

Nancy: Yes, we love the tramadol. I use lots of it. I find it's especially helpful in helping me reduce the dose of NSAIDs or in conjunction with Adequan for those who cannot tolerate NSAIDs at all.

Dr. Patty Khuly September 6th, 2009 07:38:33 AM

I always tell my clients that obese pets live 2 to 2.5 years shorter than their lean counterparts.  This has led to a common excuse I hear from owners of obese pets.  It goes something like this: "I'd rather my dog live a happier shorter life, so I'll continue to feed him whatever he wants." What these owners have failed to plug into the equation is the fact that these obese dogs will have a plethora of additional problems including cardiovascular disease, arthritis, and diabetes.  So in reality, these obese patients will live a shorter life with a much greater percentage of bad days vs. good days.  As for the owners, there is no good way to rationalize or negotiate with an irrational client!

Dennis Leon, DVM, Medical Director, Levittown Animal Hospital

http://levittownvetblog.com

Dennis Leon, DVM September 9th, 2009 04:57:43 PM

<url="Rolex'>http://www.dearwatches.com/rolex-watches-rolex-sea-dweller-c-72_10.html">Rolex Sea Dweller watches</url><url="Rolex'>http://www.dearwatches.com/rolex-watches-rolex-submariner-c-72_11.html">Rolex Submariner watches</url><url="Rolex'>http://www.dearwatches.com/rolex-watches-rolex-yachtmaster-c-72_12.html">Rolex Yachtmaster watches</url>

 

 

Rolex Yachtmaster watches November 8th, 2009 10:03:48 AM

Rolex Yachtmaster watches

Rolex Yachtmaster watches November 8th, 2009 10:23:37 AM

http://www.cartierwatches.us/A.Lange-&-Sohne/

http://www.cartierwatches.us/Breguet/

A.Lange & Sohne watch for sale November 8th, 2009 11:26:26 AM

http://www.iwcwatches.us/Audemars-Piguet/

http://www.iwcwatches.us/Bell-&-Ross/

Bell & Ross watches November 8th, 2009 11:29:19 AM

Find Cheap ugg bailey boots?UGG boots On Sale,Enjoy free shipping + bargain sale now!UGG Classic Short,100% Authentic UGG Australia Boots!ALL of UGG Classic Cardy are the cheapest and best for you!Enjoy yourself of shoping in Find Cheap Sheepskin UGG New Boots IN Ecwarm Boots.com!

UGG Classic Cardy November 11th, 2009 06:50:42 AM

Hublot replica

 

replica oris November 11th, 2009 09:18:11 AM

Panerai watch for sale

replica croum November 11th, 2009 09:35:09 AM

Louis Vuitton watch for sale

Maurice Lacroix watch for sale

replica Montblanc

Rolex watch for sale November 12th, 2009 12:46:36 PM

<a href="Breitling'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Breitling/">Breitling replica</a><a href="Burberry'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Burberry/">Burberry replica</a><a href="Bvlgari'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Burberry/">Bvlgari replica</a><a href="Cartier'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Cartier/">Cartier replica</a><a href="chopard'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Cartier/">chopard replica</a><a href="Concord'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Concord/">Concord replica</a><a href="croum'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Croum/">croum replica</a><a href="DeWitt'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/DeWitt/">DeWitt replica</a><a href="ebel'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/DeWitt/">ebel replica</a><a href="Ferrari'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Ferrari/">Ferrari replica</a><a href="Franck'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Franck-Muller/">Franck Muller replica</a><a href="Glashutte'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Glashutte/">Glashutte replica</a><a href="Graham'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Graham/">Graham replica</a><a href="Hermes'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Graham/">Hermes replica</a><a href="Hublot'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Hublot/">Hublot replica</a><a href="IWC'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/IWC/">IWC replica</a><a href="Jaquet'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Jaquet-droz/">Jaquet droz replica</a><a href="Lady'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Lady-Watches/">Lady replica</a>

DeWitt November 12th, 2009 01:40:22 PM

<a href="oris'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Oris/">oris replica</a><a href="Panerai'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Panerai/">Panerai replica</a><a href="Patek'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Patek-Philippe/">Patek Philippe replica</a><a href="Piaget'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Piaget/">Piaget replica</a><a href="Rado'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Rado/">Rado replica</a><a href="Tag'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Tag-Heuer/">Tag Heuer replica</a><a href="Tudor'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Tudor/">Tudor replica</a><a href="U-boat'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/U-boat/">U-boat replica</a><a href="Vacheron'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Vacheron-Constantin/">Vacheron Constantin replica</a><a href="Rolex'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Rolex/">Rolex replica</a><a href="Rolex'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Rolex/Air%20King/">Rolex Air-King replica</a><a href="Rolex'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Rolex/Datejust%20II/">Rolex Datejust II replica</a><a href="xxx'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Rolex/DateJust/">xxx replica</a><a href="Rolex'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Rolex/Submariner/">Rolex Submariner replica</a><a href="Yachtmaster'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Rolex/Yachtmaster/">Yachtmaster replica</a><a href="Rolex'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Rolex/Day%20Date%20II/">Rolex Day-Date II replica</a><a href="Rolex'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Rolex/Daytona/">Rolex Daytona replica</a><a href="Rolex'>http://www.iwcwatches.us/Rolex/Explorer/">Rolex Explorer replica</a>

Vacheron Constantin November 12th, 2009 01:40:44 PM

<a href="Rolex'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Rolex/Explorer/">Rolex Explorer watch for sale</a><a href="Rolex'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Rolex/GMT/">Rolex GMT watch for sale</a><a href="Rolex'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Rolex/Sea%20Dweller/">Rolex Sea-Dweller watch for sale</a><a href="Rolex'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Rolex/Day%20Date/">Rolex Day Date watch for sale</a><a href="Rolex'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Rolex/Masterpiece/">Rolex Masterpiece watch for sale</a><a href="Rolex'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Rolex/Milgauss/">Rolex Milgauss watch for sale</a><a href="replica'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/">replica watch</a><a href="replica'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/A.Lange-&amp;-Sohne/">replica A.Lange &amp;Sohne</a><a href="replica'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Audemars-Piguet/">replica Audemars Piguet</a><a href="replica'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Bell-&amp;-Ross/">replica Bell &amp; Ross</a><a href="replica'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Breguet/">replica Breguet</a><a href="replica'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Breitling/">replica Breitling</a><a href="replica'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Burberry/">replica Burberry</a><a href="replica'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Bvlgari/">replica Bvlgari</a><a href="replica'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Cartier/">replica Cartier</a><a href="replica'>http://www.cartierwatches.us/Chopard/">replica chopard</a>

Bell & November 12th, 2009 01:41:05 PM

However mean your life is, tiffany jewelry meet it and live it do not shun it and call it hard discount tiffany jewelry unt tiffany jewelry It is not so bad as you are.It looks poorest when you are richest.

tiffany jewelry November 12th, 2009 08:58:24 PM

Rolex Masterpiece watch for sale

Rolex Milgauss watch for sale November 15th, 2009 03:07:25 PM

Louis Vuitton watches

Longines watches

Lady Watch watches

Jaquet droz watches

IWC watches

Maurice Lacroix watches November 16th, 2009 10:23:23 AM

Nah bagi sahabat sekalian yang ingin berpartisipasi dalam kontes ini, silahkan menuju situs beritajitu. Disana sahabat akan mendapatkan keterangan lebih jelas dan bisa pula membaca berita-berita hangat dari seantero jagad raya. Sebelum berpisyah saya mengajak sohib-sohib semua, mari kita memulai sebuah langkah kecil untuk Mengembalikan Jati Diri Bangsa sesuai dengan kemampuan masing-masing. Salam -- http://khai.yehia.org

Mengembalikan Jati Diri Bangsa November 17th, 2009 06:16:02 AM

Your article very interesting, I have introduced a lot of friends look at this article, the content of the articles there will be a lot of attractive people to appreciate, I have to thank you such an article. Khairuddin Syach Weblog | Mengembalikan jati diri bangsa | Mengembalikan jati diri bangsa | Ikan Baris Gratis | Panti Asuhan | Mengembalikan jati diri bangsa | Info Pendidikan Indonesia | Rangkuman Ilmu SEO | Blog Edu | Rama | Blogger Gurem | Situs Murah | Cahbagus | Oes Tsetnoc | Febry Riyanto | http://khai.yehia.org

khay November 17th, 2009 06:19:51 AM

http://www.cheapgoodssale.com

china wholeshoe November 18th, 2009 11:25:58 AM

For Christmas Day is coming,many people have done for the Christmas gifts are carefully selected for the preparation,I tell you ,selecting chrismas gifts unavoidable to choose wholesale clothing,mac cosmetics,gucci shoes,p90x etc,welcome order here and enjoy yourself.

Goodluck November 19th, 2009 03:19:50 PM

ebel replica

Ferrari replica

Franck Muller replica

Graham replica

DeWitt replica November 20th, 2009 10:59:44 AM

Add Commment

Your Name:

CAPTCHA Verification